All Comments on 'End Goaling in Writing Erotica'

A very good introduction to reminders about erotica. It is very much appreciated.

A very nice treatise but I don't think you went far enough.

What you failed to mention is things which are NOT erotic

per se but which some sophomoric writers use, mostly size,

e.g. "I groped her 36DD tits as I stuck my 10 inch dong into her."

This may get the sex-starved teenagers hot and bothered

but does nothing to move the story along as far as I am concerned.

It leaves very little to the imagination, and the purpose of a

story of this genre is to titillate the imagination. (How about something

like "I squeezed here ample breasts while I entered her."?

The language is just full of adjectives which can be used,

and "ample" for Bob may be different then "ample" for Dave.)

I also disagree somewhat with your comment about not getting

bogged down in background. (For various values of "bogged down.")

Of course, three pages of family history for each of the characters

is overkill, but I would like to understand from the narrative how

Jim and Jane wound up at the "NoTell Motel" and are now

screwing each other's brains out. (This actually reinforces your

point about making the "contract" believable to the reader.)

I could not agree more with your comment about "sentence structure,

grammar, spelling, punctuation, and word usage." Many is the

time that I've stopped reading what may have been an otherwise enjoyable

story because of these. E.G. - "I was board, so I went and got another

beer." I can live with one or two of these per submission, but when

I find such things in every other paragraph, I bail out.

This gracious Writer introduces, and reintroduces the finer points of writing Erotica. Even if you feel you have already learned the finer points, a little reinforcement, a relearning process if you will, is highly recommendable. In essense, that is exactly where this Writer succeeds. A useful guide, especially for the beginning Writer.

Every author has their own style of writing, but your tome generally applies to all. The only points I don't wholly agree with are 1) Your view on character developement. I believe it's very important in a good story. In a wham, Bam, Thank You Maam tale; not so. 2) I don't think full proper character development of the main characters can occur in a story told in the first person style without some long-winded explanations. Other wise well done. Thank You. Ronnie W.

You make some very good points, and I agree with most of them.

However, I like plenty of background, so I look for it in other's stories and provide it in my own. Yes, there's such a thing as too much, but it's critical to establish the psycho-emotional connection that gives credibility to the sex. All my stories are from my life or those I know well, and I can honestly say that of the approximately 150 women I've bedded, there were only two that I didn't like. Yes, there were plenty I made that connection with in quite a short period of time, but I explain how that happened in the stories, which makes them believable.

Another point you make is how excellent a writer one must be to write a tease story. In my experience here, people want SEX and are disappointed when they don't get it. I do not "get the girl" in several of my tales, and those stories, written just as carefully as the "got her" ones, are consistently rated relatively low. But, hey--my stories are true experiences, and in real life you don't always get the girl or have the good judgement to pass.

I think it's a little more complicated.

I see three basic arenas under "Writing Erotica"

- Stroke stories (which generally aren't very literate and pretend to be nothing but stroke stories; many examples on this site)

- Literature (which contains erotic content and is generally well written, well edited and literate; Lady Chatterley's Lover by D. H. Lawrence is an excellent example)

- Erotica (may contain elements of both stroke stories and literature ... may we call it Literotica? Story of O or many - but not near enough - novellas and short stories on this site)

Each of these have a different target audience. The goal would be to write the story this audience wants and expects. This is somewhat addressed on Erotic Story sites by using categories and story tags. Woe be to the author that misuses and/or abuses the story classification.

Another way of looking at this is to compare the three categories I mentioned to movies: what are the expectations of respective viewers for hard porn, soft porn and a movie such as Nine 1/2 Weeks or Wild Orchid, both of which set a plausible stage for the erotic scenes.

I see no reason a story cannot be well written and edited even on an erotic story site. I know many disagree with me but I consider a story such as thecelt's fine Consequences: Delia from today an appropriate story for this site even though the erotic content is largely in the minds of the readers - put there by the writer's fine skills.

Thanks for bringing the topic up - airing different viewpoints can never be bad.

Regards, Jack

I return to respond to comments on my story here because I thought the comments were very thoughtful and interesting and because I did want to reiterate "sticking to" a couple of my points despite some of the comments.

I thought the most recent comment on the different purposes of erotic stories was very good (it's quite true that readers come here for a sliding-scale expectation that runs from glow to gush--and there's nothing wrong with that.) And I also think that the comments by the poster who said I should have covered the "don'ts" as well as the "do's" offered up good points for a writer of erotica to consider. But I also didn't see where the one on styles contrasted with anything I wrote in my essay and I didn't really see a responsibility to provide in one essay a comprehensive discussion of the topic (especially since the topic was on the goal--not the pitfalls).

I do wish to reinforce my belief that it's easy (and not usually good) to give too much background and also too much charicterization--and that first person perspective writing is actually very good for erotica, not something to avoid if the context welcomes it. Both of these points go to the center of the topic of my essay--the end goal of writing erotica.

I take this end goal as satisfying readers, whether they've come to glow or to gush. So, first of all, one specific story isn't going to do everything for everyone and there's no reason it should. For that reason, I try to write across a broad spectrum of possible interests, trying to please someone greatly with each one. Trying to please everyone results in pablum. And when someone drops a comment on one of my stories that I don't like reading that sort of story, my response is--well someone does, so just read some other stories; I bet I have one or two posted here that were meant for your interests. (And I laugh, because invariably they are slashing a story that has gone hot--and would have stayed hot if they hadn't dropped a judgmental "1" rating on it--so it, in fact, did end goal well for a good many readers here.)

And in satisfying readers, the reactions I've gotten to my stories is that the most satisfaction comes from enabling the reader to see themselves inside the story--as giving or receiving, depending on their inclination of that day, and as giving or receiving it in a way that heats them up. To accomplish this sort of writing screams for use of the first person and for not giving so much background or character description that it freezes the reader out of imaging themselves as that person. So, I continue to believe (and the pattern of my story ratings here supports the contention)that first person perspective and "only just enough" background and characterization are good things for erotica.

That said, I think that fresh perspectives, surprises, and exotic situations and backgrounds also help to make a story sensuous. and sensuous is the bread and butter of erotica.

I do wholly agree with what the most recent commenter said about the combination of erotic and literary as being both the most worthwhile style and the least appreciated one (although more so here at Literotica than any other site I've found, I think). Although I try to write across the spectrum myself, the stories that I think are my best (and that can get me to flow each time I read or think about them) are the ones that include considerable amounts in pleasing/surprising combinations of four elements: sexual heat, humor, surprise, and human condition profoundity. But this would be the subject of another "how-to" essay.

You've given us authors of erotic fiction some good advice.

Thank you.

I don't write well but I write well enough to appreciate the work that goes into writing well. jerry

Particularly agree with your view that too much background can kill interest in a story. If that's what you want, buy a book.

I like just enough (as you say)to make it believable.

Cheers, HH

Not only for reminding me of the most basic things we all often may let slip from the brain occasionally; but also the much more difficult challenges and goals, that make writing (especially various types of smut) the true joy and fun that it can (and should) be!

As I continuing adding more and more chapters to my already long-ongoing, multiple-chapter, gay romance novelette (that I may never be able to find a way to end, even after 38 chapters); and venture out into new and much shorter stories that do climax quickly; and re-energize (when need be) with the shear fun of 'pounding off' an occasional stand-alone, new and pure stroke story for readers....I am pretty certain I will be referring back to your words here quite often.

Five stars and eight inches UP for the tidbits of wisdom you shared! :)

A good book for first person perspective is Marcy Kennedy's A Busy Writer's Guide: Deep Point of View.