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Dom/me Self-Indulgence

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MsWorthy

Really Really Experienced
Joined
Jul 25, 2002
Posts
445
Since dom/mes get their way more often than not, do you consider them to be self-indulgent? Do you think that dom/mes are more self-indulgent as a group than other people, in general?

If so, do you view this as "good," bad," or neutral?

Are self-control and self-indulgence mutually exclusive?

~Is this too many questions for one topic? I am interested in other's opinions.~
 
MsWorthy said:
Since dom/mes get their way more often than not, do you consider them to be self-indulgent? Do you think that dom/mes are more self-indulgent as a group than other people, in general?
Click to expand...

Not as a definition. Particularly because a submissive also gets "their way" in that they desire to submit, to please, to meet the needs and fulfill the desires of a Dominant. So, by choosing to submit, aren't they also "indulging themselves?"

Particularly in light of the fact that BDSM activities can make one persona non grata in the eyes of the larger society and so must be enacted with varying degrees of privacy and/or secrecy, choosing to be deviant (meaning, choosing to live in recognition rather than repression of one's socially unacceptable desires) is easily seen as rebellious, self-indulgent and possibly irresponsible--if not worse. However, it is equally "self-indulgent" to live as fully as possible according to the culturally endorsed social mores; doing so just "indulges," or emphasizes, a different set of priorities--the desire to be accepted and recognized as part of the power-weilding Center of society rather than consciously choose to live at the margin.

If so, do you view this as "good," bad," or neutral?
Click to expand...
N/A

Are self-control and self-indulgence mutually exclusive?
Click to expand...
Not for a control freak. :D


~Is this too many questions for one topic? I am interested in other's opinions.~
Click to expand...
Nah...we like questions. Right?

Interesting question, MzW. You continue to bring a welcome dose of intellectual stimuli with you, I see. ;)

(Edited to fix those pesky html commands)
 
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Not so simple

I think that would be an over simplification of the dom role. As a Dom, I don't do the things I want to do. I do the things "we want to do" It would look from the outside that it is a me thing, it is not. It is like any other relationship, it doesn't happen unless we alow it. Sure It is the doms role to lead, but a good Dom's skill is his intuition as to where it is "we are going" As a Dom what excites me is seeing my sub being excited, aroused, having an ecstatic exsperience that only I can create. If she (sub) is not getting off on what I am doing it is a complete waste of our time. I am not saying that that is how others exsperience this, but it the way my brain works. I am the creator of a scene, but it is a very fine and artfull production always desighned for our mutual plaesure. Am I self centered in that, yes, is that bad? NO, wouldn't the world be a much better place if everyone pursued what they wanted, and stopped all the games, all the behaviour molding for acceptance, and just were themselves. I can't see any harm in being myself. Self indulgent, of course, but my pleasure is her pleasure, if not it is time for me to play with someone else. Or If your dom is just doing what he likes, you as a sub should play with someone else.
 
Re: Re: Dom/me Self-Indulgence

Thank you for responding. You both make excellent points.

RisiaSkye said:

Nah...we like questions. Right?
Click to expand...

I certainly do. I tend to enjoy the sound of my own opinion :)



Interesting question, MzW. You continue to bring a welcome dose of intellectual stimuli with you, I see. ;)

(Edited to fix those pesky html commands)
Click to expand...

Thank you, Risia.
 
Re: Re: Re: Dom/me Self-Indulgence

MsWorthy said:

I certainly do. I tend to enjoy the sound of my own opinion :)
Click to expand...
LOL.
Shit, don't we all? At least you can admit it.

Thank you, Risia.
Click to expand...
You're very welcome. I've been enjoying what you bring to the conversation, so thank you.


~~ [mini hijack]
I'm just full of "Cumbaya" moments lately, aren't I? *chuckle*

Of course, just to undermine my recent bout of warm-fuzzies I'll take this chance to point out to all of you that have been calling it "Kum Ba Ya" or some such nonsense that your spelling could use a little work. ;)
[/hijack]
 
Re: Re: Re: Re: Dom/me Self-Indulgence

RisiaSkye said:

LOL.
Shit, don't we all? At least you can admit it.


You're very welcome. I've been enjoying what you bring to the conversation, so thank you.


~~ [mini hijack]
I'm just full of "Cumbaya" moments lately, aren't I? *chuckle*

Of course, just to undermine my recent bout of warm-fuzzies I'll take this chance to point out to all of you that have been calling it "Kum Ba Ya" or some such nonsense that your spelling could use a little work. ;)
[/hijack]
Click to expand...


Ok Ok Ok,...I like the sound of my opinions too.(Boo Hoo)

Never used"Cumbaya",...What the hell does it mean?

CONFESSION # 2-I have always misspelled the word "CONSENSUAL"-(Boo Hoo)
 
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Dom/me Self-Indulgence

artful said:


Ok Ok Ok,...I like the sound of my opinions too.(Boo Hoo)

Never used"Cumbaya",...What the hell does it mean?

CONFESSION # 2-I have always misspelled the word "CONSENSUAL"-(Boo Hoo)
Click to expand...

LOL
Artful, what is the boo hoo for?

Won't you reply to the topic?

~I would also really like to hear what the submissives have to say on this topic. A dominant is often seen most clearly through a submissive's eyes.~
 
MsWorthy said:

~I would also really like to hear what the submissives have to say on this topic. A dominant is often seen most clearly through a submissive's eyes.~
Click to expand...

I was sorta dreading you saying that ;)

I will have a stab at trying to set my thoughts down on paper - but, as awlays, can only really speak from the perpective of my own Dom.


MsWorthy said:
Since dom/mes get their way more often than not, do you consider them to be self-indulgent? Do you think that dom/mes are more self-indulgent as a group than other people, in general?

If so, do you view this as "good," bad," or neutral?

Are self-control and self-indulgence mutually exclusive?

~Is this too many questions for one topic? I am interested in other's opinions.~
Click to expand...

I don't consider Robuck to be self-indulgent. In fact I would go as far as saying that he puts himself out to ensure I am satisfied before making sure he is. To put it into a phrase he often uses when he emails me from work (shhhh - don't let the boss know) "My pleasure is your pleasure".
I don't think you can generalise that Dom/mes "are more self-indulgent as a group than other people, in general.".

That said, your next question is a not applicable :)

Are self-control and self-indulgence mutually exclusive? Tough one ... but, no, I don't think so ... rather, it would be better to say, not necessarily.


(And if I were marking my post I would only give it 2/10 for effort :( Will try and add more in the morning.)
 
MsWorthy said:
If so, do you view this as "good," bad," or neutral?
Click to expand...

Being self-indulgent does not make me a bad person.

Are self-control and self-indulgence mutually exclusive?

To be an effective Dom/me, you must have self-control, and that tempers self-indulgence in my opinion.

MsW great questions!

Ebony
 
MsWorthy and I will TRY to respond to the questions(gray areas are SO difficult for me to participate in though) said:
Since dom/mes get their way more often than not, do you consider them to be self-indulgent?
<snip>
I get My way every time! Does this mean I am self-indulgent,...no. An explanation:

I will have her welfare as a # 1 priority in whatever decisions I make. I know that some people will disagree with this but, IF I took my sub to Wal-Mart's,(yes,...I am a Wal-Mart man), with no specific purchase in mind, and allowed her to go do her shopping while I sat at the Deli drinking coffee, I might have given her a $40.00
limit to spend however she wanted to.


She comes back with a necklace for Me to wear. I may allow her to do that. Do I see that as being self indulging on My part?-No! The light that shines in HER eyes each time she looks at it is her reward. Does this mean what she has sacrificed is not rewarded another day,...in another way? Of course not.


I will ALWAYS do my best to make her happy. What if I don't like the necklace? I would not be dishonest with her and say she has pleased me,...nor would I express a cruel demeanor toward her unsuccessful effort. We would discuss the issue,...and I would find some OTHER way to make her happy.


To me,...my sub is the most VALUABLE possession in my life, but if I can't excercise the control over her that is MY need, then it is not a relationship I want. What if she chose to buy new clothes for her children? IF it made her HAPPY,...I would allow the purchase,... you see,...it's NOT about self indulgence, it's about decision making and control.

**************************************************

<snip>

Do you think that dom/mes are more self-indulgent as a group than other people, in general?-A real Dom/me,...NO! In fact,...I think as a group,... we sacrifice to please our subs,...in a more meaningful way than 'nilla relationships.

**************************************************

If so, do you view this as "good," bad," or neutral?-N/A

**************************************************

Are self-control and self-indulgence mutually exclusive?-I'm not sure what you are meaning here.

**************************************************

~Is this too many questions for one topic?-YES,
but only my humble opinion-rotflmao :rose:


I am interested in other's opinions.~
Click to expand...
 
With a service orientated submissive it would appear so. But as RS pointed out, the sub is exactly where they want to be. I don't think I'm self-indulgent, but I hate being told what to do.
 
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Dom/me Self-Indulgence

MsWorthy said:


LOL
Artful, what is the boo hoo for?

Won't you reply to the topic?

~I would also really like to hear what the submissives have to say on this topic. A dominant is often seen most clearly through a submissive's eyes.~
Click to expand...


*Any good submissive will tell you that you don't indulge yourself enough MsWorthy. A dom/me should always take full advantage of a willing sub within the boundaries they have previously aggreed upon.
 
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Dom/me Self-Indulgence

beatrice51 said:



*Any good submissive will tell you that you don't indulge yourself enough MsWorthy. A dom/me should always take full advantage of a willing sub within the boundaries they have previously aggreed upon.
Click to expand...

Well, thank you Bea....lol. But you didn't respond to the topic.

~teasing Bea, as I have known her for a while.~
 
A Dom/me is only self indulgent when the ignore the needs and desires of his or her sub.

That is to say, that if I have discussed with my Dom my lousy and regrettable experience with whipping and state clearly that it isn't something I am ready to do again, yet. then he whips me while scening...that is self indulgent behavior. I also had better find a different Dom.

So, "good Doms" are not self indulgent and in fact, are often required to excercise self control when placing the sub's needs first.

ON the other hand, aren't we all self indulgent and self absorbed? I wouldnt' engage in a relationship because I enjoy serving a Dom, rather it is that specific Dom who makes me twitch, who meets my needs.

Yep, I am simply reiterating a bazillion other posts on this thread, but felt a need to drop in!

:D
 
I have been way too self indulgent sometimes and have fucked things up by it. I think maybe its an occupational hazard for a domme. But live and learn.
 
MissTaken said:
A Dom/me is only self indulgent when the ignore the needs and desires of his or her sub.

That is to say, that if I have discussed with my Dom my lousy and regrettable experience with whipping and state clearly that it isn't something I am ready to do again, yet. then he whips me while scening...that is self indulgent behavior. I also had better find a different Dom.

So, "good Doms" are not self indulgent and in fact, are often required to excercise self control when placing the sub's needs first.

ON the other hand, aren't we all self indulgent and self absorbed? I wouldnt' engage in a relationship because I enjoy serving a Dom, rather it is that specific Dom who makes me twitch, who meets my needs.

Yep, I am simply reiterating a bazillion other posts on this thread, but felt a need to drop in!

:D
Click to expand...

Thank you, MissT. Your reiteration is well received....*smiles* You state it so well :)
 
Thank you - Willow, Ebony (I think self-control does temper self-indulgence when we are serious about being aware of ourselves), Artful, WriterDom, MzChrista (I see your point and agree that self-indulgence can be a natural hazard for a domme) - for posting.
 
MsWorthy said:
Since dom/mes get their way more often than not, do you consider them to be self-indulgent? Do you think that dom/mes are more self-indulgent as a group than other people, in general?

If so, do you view this as "good," bad," or neutral?

Are self-control and self-indulgence mutually exclusive?

~Is this too many questions for one topic? I am interested in other's opinions.~
Click to expand...

It never occurred to me to think along these lines in my relationship with Himself. This is so much more complicated, I think, than it looks on the surface.

There are elements of our relationship that are absolutely about Himself. There are things I do to make certain that hi needs are absolutely met. I have his favorite things to eat, to drink at my house all the time. And he expects them. He has only to mention something that he likes or wants and it is done (well there was that drawer full of used batteries that I was to see about that took me some time to get around to... but otherwise).

He mentions he likes me to dress a certain way or wear a certain outfit, I do that. He likes blouses that button... I look for them every time I shop. He likes a certain kind of sheets, I make certain that I have them freshly laundered and on the bed at all times.

Why do I do that? Because I care that his needs are met. I care what he wants. I care what he needs. I don't know if he expects these things, I just do them because I know that it pleases him that I do.

Just like in Shadowsdream's thread where she is describing how she likes her coffee. Half water, half milk and 2 (gulp... I think, I didn't check) sugars. I remember those things because they are important to others.

Do I think Himself is more self indulgent that others in the population? I have been around a long time, and I think men like women to do those things anyway... BDSM or not... or as Himself would say that is one of those "Mars/Venus" kind of things.

It is not a bad or good thing... it just is part of who we are...

I can only speak about Himself, but it helps that he is a control freak... and that he has great self control. I tend to try his patience at times... But I can't say that they are mutually exclusive. But because of circumstances in his life, there must at times be absolute self control, but I do not see this as self indulgent behavior.

And no, MsWorthy, there can never be too many questions.
 
beatrice51 said:



*Any good submissive will tell you that you don't indulge yourself enough MsWorthy. A dom/me should always take full advantage of a willing sub within the boundaries they have previously aggreed upon.
Click to expand...

beatrice51,...I hope it's ok to call you bea.
Because you have connection with MsW, I welcome you to the BDSM Forum with open arms. I will shelve all other directions and comments toward a newbie, simply because I know MsW has done her homework. Never-the-less,...I'm SO glad to meet you. :rose:
 
Re: Re: Dom/me Self-Indulgence

cellis said:


It never occurred to me to think along these lines in my relationship with Himself. This is so much more complicated, I think, than it looks on the surface.
Click to expand...

I think there can be more below the surface too, cellis...*smiles* and you address those issues well.


It is not a bad or good thing... it just is part of who we are...
Click to expand...

Good point.
 
Re: Re: Dom/me Self-Indulgence

Originally posted by artful

Because you have connection with MsW, I welcome you to the BDSM Forum with open arms. I will shelve all other directions and comments toward a newbie, simply because I know MsW has done her homework. Never-the-less,...I'm SO glad to meet you. :rose:
Click to expand...
Thank you, Artful. You have been most gracious to me and now you welcome a friend of mine. I do appreciate your kindness.
 
Wondering where self indulgence becomes arrogance...ego tripping...

Thinking self indulgence has nothing to do with control but can be a very good sign of a lack of self control.

Any ideas to help out this inquisitive Domme?
 
Shadows

Shadowsdream said:
Wondering where self indulgence becomes arrogance...ego tripping...I can see where this may be experienced by SOME!

Thinking self indulgence has nothing to do with control but can be a very good sign of a lack of self control.I agree!

Any ideas to help out this inquisitive Domme?
Click to expand...
 
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Shadowsdream said:
Wondering where self indulgence becomes arrogance...ego tripping...
Click to expand...

I think this is a very real possiblity/risk if we do not stay in touch with our own motives/attitude/reality.


Thinking self indulgence has nothing to do with control but can be a very good sign of a lack of self control.

Any ideas to help out this inquisitive Domme?
Click to expand...

I think a lifestyle relationship presents a dichotomy for a dom/me and can be a thin line to walk at times.

We spend much time staying in control of our partners.
Staying in control of our reactions, our tempers (if we have that issue), our moods.
Planning for our future, budgeting, handling money, and making decisions.
Teaching, guiding, correcting.

While we are busy controlling, our partners are busy making our lives easier. They cater to us, wait on us, pamper us, and do as we wish in all things (agreed upon).

It is easy to lose sight of the fact that we are only special to our partners, That we are only deserving of this special treatment because they believe we are. We are only rulers of our own domains. We are in control of only that part which our partners allow us to control. It is easy to forget this truth and become arrogant, and go on an "ego-trip," deluding ourselves into believing that we, somehow, inherently deserve this special treatment.

The dichotomy: we are in control - but only of that which we are allowed to control (she is in control).

The dichotomy: we are so busy noticing the areas in which we have control - one's partner, home, "things," children, tempers, moods, money - that we can easily not notice that we have become self-indulgent (not in control) in other areas - ego, drugs/alcohol/food, job/career, attitude.

~see sig line...*smiles*~
 
MsWorthy

(It is easy to forget this truth and become arrogant, and go on an "ego-trip," deluding ourselves into believing that we, somehow, inherently deserve this special treatment. )

Sometimes when You have a long time history of Domination it is easier to see or feel when that arrogance=ego is getting out of control.

Your answer is a wonderful touch of reality for new Dominants to consider as well. So often I have seen EGO=Idiotic behaviour thought to be the correct posturing and expectation of the submissive. Sometimes it is what the sub thinks is heavenly.

But what can be ok in scene mode is pathetic in 24/7 mode.

Thank You for the depth of the response.
 
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