All Comments on 'What Does It Mean? Ch. 02'

You made your point! Forsake all others means everyone else. Once again it was the deceit, lying and betrayal that finished this marriage. When revenge is telling the truth who can call that cruel? The psychiatrist should have been sued for malpractice since she abused her relationship with her patient and that case would have yielded more money. Great Story - Thanks_______________________________________

SleeplessinMD

This all seemed so unlikely. The MD risking her license for some trim.. it does happen, but not likely. The ease with which the guy managed everything was hard to believe, too. It was all cut and dried and had little suspense or tension.

The two KEY clues are -- the psychiatrist who didnt have her wedding band on when seeing patients. That excuse cannot possibly be accurate or believeable !!!! if anything it might force couple in therapy to try harder

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second... why did the wife go back to see the psychiatrist if she was NOT mentally ill? psychotherapy should NOT be done by psychiatrists.

The two KEY clues are -- the psychiatrist who didnt have her wedding band on when seeing patients. That excuse cannot possibly be accurate or believeable !!!! if anything it might force couple in therapy to try harder

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second... why did the wife go back to see the psychiatrist if she was NOT mentally ill? psychotherapy should NOT be done by psychiatrists.

<p>I only read the first few paragraphs of this "story." I didn't bother reading the remainder because it is clear the writer has no technical skills. Here's why I didn't bother reading this chapter, though I skimmed it very quickly. That only took me a few seconds. </p>

<p>"Thursday afternoon I was at the psychiatrists office early..."</p>

<p>The writer was probably talking about the office belonging to the psychiatrist, but that is not what she said. It could have been an error but then another error was written in the next paragraph.</p>

<p>...finally got into the psychiatrist office she had us sit...</p>

<p>For those of you who don't see there should have been a comma after "office," you should go back to elementary school and get the same remedial education in punctuation this writer needs to get.</p>

<p>Beyond that, this "story" is just awful. This "writer" has no skills at developing plausible characters at all. On the one hand, he invents a thoroughly unlikable, "in your face," dominating kind of male. On the other hand, the wife is a caricature of a slutty, submissive female. Neither deliver any insight into the problem of infidelity.</p>

</p>The dialogue limps along from one scene to the next without advancing the story line. The dialogue reads like it was pulled from a dictionary of formal, unexciting phrases too. In particular, anyone who thinks a psychiatrist talks as Agena has her doing, or that a psychiatrist will deliver pontifications as he has this one doing needs to do a little research.</p>

<p>This writer would be well advised to stop writing until his deficiencies in grammar, punctuation, and syntax are corrected. Then, after a few years of writing classes, he should try again.</p>

<p>Ron123XYZ@foreveranonymous.naturally</p>

That's what happens when you wimp out and take the cheating slut back. He shoulda just dumped her her cheating ass like he planned to do in the first place.

poor story; not worth more than 25 points out of 100. 50 would mean it is "average;" well, this is not an "average" story. it's so bad I didn't even read who "that woman" was; I assume it's the "flush" psychiatrist who lost her license and 100 grands? it doesn't matter...

The prose here is mediocre, being marred by numerous syntactic errors, typographical mistakes and blunders in word choices. A good proof-reading pass or a conscientious editor would've helped greatly. The author's fascination with techno-toys is cute but doesn't add much to the story. The machinations with the hotel desk clerk are improbable. Unless the desk clerk likes flipping burgers for a living, why would he risk his job? If our hero turns out to be an investigator hired by the company to ensure that the company's regulations are being followed, Mr. Genius Desk Clerk gets canned. Then again maybe the desk clerk doesn't care about his job. Who knows? I suppose if you're willing to suspend disbelief, this tom-foolery is all well and good.

<P>

The author's portrayal of the psychiatrist (did she have a name or was she just some faceless "psychobabbler"?) is a bit farfetched. As a health care professional, engaging in a sexual relationship with a patient is pretty much guaranteed to get you arrested and your license revoked. Yet the author wants us to believe that the good doctor would happily toss her career into the toilet for a lesbian quickie at the Best Western? Right.

<P>

The alienation of affection lawsuit was equally improbable since that particular legal action is no longer allowed in forty-two of the fifty states in the Union. But, hey, it's still allowed in eight states though most attorneys no longer advise their clients to attempt the suit. If it floats your boat, go for it.

<P>

The resolution of the story's conflict was tolerably handled but the hubby's joyous romp off into the sunset was assinine. At the end of the story, I asked myself, "Instead of all this brain-dead leaping about, why didn't Jim get a legal separation from Grace then file for divorce on the grounds of irreconcilable differences?" That seems a lot more probable to me.

I thought that your previous story "She Needed the Pain" was a classic of this genre. This story however, is much too simplistic. Having the wife suddenly turn lesbian made no sense. You fell to a stereotype as repulsive as all the big black cock stories that abound here. You could have done better and you have before.

Give it up on the sintax [is that a tax on sins?]. And an oh no on the missin coomma. Surely a good editor [hint] will rite that grievous maelstrom of misteaks[so there speeller bee and tax poison].<P>

The subject was one that needed to be addressed to spite the erroneous Oder prevailing here to the contrary.<P>

Author - your content and purpose is appreciated by those into reality and life's consequences. Inescapable ain't they.

The truth is in the ending as that she has found that she is a lesbian or at the very least a bisexual if she still has a desire for men also. This was not a very well drawn out ending chapter as there is nothing about the wife’s own feelings given us.<p>I think you do a good job writing but I would like to see all the characters thoughts revealed. We have a one sided version of I am strong in my beliefs and I did what I know is right and I now have everything I always wanted in my life. The wife’s character is not developed at all and the story is just too one sided as it doesn’t make the reader feel like they are involved in what is transpiring at all. It is more an essay of “Hey, want to here what went down a few years ago.” Emotion was lacking for me in this story.<p>Thanks for your effort.<p>PT

Agena:<p>I have to agree with 'peggytwitty' that the wife in this story was pretty much one dimensional. I'm not really clear why she wanted to dally with "Clara" in the first chapter, and I'll be darned if I can figure out why, in this chapter, she thought getting it on with her therapist was a part of valid therapy. Would she have been so willing to "act out" if her therapist had been a man? She certainly couldn't have been the brightest bulb in the box in not discerning that substituting the "Best Western" for the psychiatrist's office was not acceptable practice.<p>I have to agree with 'Alvaron' regarding the psychiatrist's form of therapy. Reward vs. risk is so unbalanced here that it just isn't believable and really hurts the story as a plot device. I would have found the wife taking up again with "Clara" more credible.<p>Agena, thank you for your story. For me it was average at best.

them clearly. A man who accepts zero tolerance on his marriage vows. A woman who was once very stupid, then knowing her husbands views on marriage vows, cheats again with a lesbian lover for weeks. Had the wife talked to the husband and got him to accept threesomes with women for her, then it would have been we hope, SAFE SANE and CONSENSUAL. As it was with the wife knowign what she knew about her husband, itw as not safe, it was not sane if she wanted to be married, and it definately was not consensual. We have heard from years about cheating men that men think with their cocks. Well ladies we hare hearing more and more about women who think with their hormones and cunts, and all evidence of brains goes out the window. One might read Literotica's "Yesterday's Gone" for a different possible ending. As Sherman said "War is Hell" and a ruined marriage is war on its rawest terms.

I applaud you for taking on a sequel, but I am not clear on, why you did it. I just want to encourage you, as others have in other ways, to make sure you are clear why exactly you are making a sequel and what exactly is the process you are planning to take EACH of the character. The emphasis I put on ‘each’ should indicate that I felt that at least with the wife’s character the process was not clear at all. I am not talking about creating a split screen and hopping into the wife’s POV (personally I dislike this practice). I am just talking about creating in your own mind a coherent view of who the wife was; what were her problems; why she did it in the first place; why she repeated it. If you couldn’t explain it to yourself you could not explain it to the readers. If the wife was sincere in the therapy and found in the process that she was bisexual or lesbian, why not open up and share the findings with the husband? If she was not sincere why did she engage in this charade to begin with? If there was some combination of the two regarding her motivations –you should have shown that too. <P>

Like PHILIPINNORCAL I was having hard time believing that the wife was so dumb as to not realize that therapy through having sex with your psychiatrist is a joke. <P>

Style wise - PPEGGYTWITTY was correct in pointing out that too much of this chapter came as a rushed summary, which deprive the reader from a dramatic tension. If you feel that there is no dramatic merit to a portion of the narrative, put as much as possible of it in the shortest possible way either in the preface or in the epilogue, and the rest, only to the minimum, in the body of the story. Otherwise, it comes across as if you are going through the motions with the chapter.

It is a simplistic story about a simplistic situation with a simplistic solution. Perfect. Only detractors with an Oprah mindset would have a problem with it. Again, cheating is cheating. Nothing wrong with forgiving her once - that is excusable. Forgiving her twice - inexcusable. $100,000 settlement was chickenfeed.

Forgive you once shame on you, forgive you twice shame on me. Actually a cheating slut doesnt really require forgiveness, just a very quick divorce so you can recycle and get someone with a better sense of morals and ethics.

if you spent your time writing and stop badmouthing orgey your stories would be better.is it her money or her race that bothers you.

really enjoyed this story, cheating is cheating. I really love the dig on oprah. i hate that woman and her show. Most these women cant realize she is a money thing, she dont care what she has on her show. as long as she gets the ratings. i know other shows are like that but she is the worst, the bigggest hypocrit on tv by far.

"It wasn't supposed to happen. She called me one day after that meeting we had in her office and asked if I wanted to meet with her in the evenings at her office for consultation. She thought I might have a fixation on lesbianism. When we got together she suggested we act out some of the things I did with Clara and the next thing I knew I was hooked again. I'm so sorry.

It is a small thing but the above is illegal and we psychologists train against this sort of thing happening. Also she would not just lose her license as this is a criminal act. Does the word RAPE mean anything to you? These stories should never have psychologists in them as it is apparent that the authors do not know what we do.

OH POO,If the only thing you can find to criticize are couple of mispelled word's, or misplaced coma's, and you feel this is so terrible that it caused you to act like a blubbering idiot, why don,t don't you sit your rightous little butt down and write some stories for us to read or are you to afraid someone may find a mistake and make it a big issue?One should be careful how one judge's, unless they can do better, or also be be judged.

Thought it was great. And as far as being fiction, you just KNOW that somewhere out there, there are people that could tell you a true story you would never believe. Truth is stranger than fiction. Thanks for you hard work and writing.

I want legal marriage abolished to prevent such crap the courts hand out to males all over. Each gender then has to take personal responsibility for their own behavior - if a fem gets herself pg she has to deal with it without the luxury of the state making him pay her for her whelp.

was the clever bit where he got around the privacy laws by renting the room himself and just allowing his wife etc access. Very nice!

After all that grief and remorse, she turns around almost immediately and does it again full tilt, all the way, not even prefaced by a month or so of comforting womanly hugs of the kind women give each other all the time? Un-f-ing-believeable! She isn't that cunning and calculating, or stupidly impercipient, or libidinously out of control, or flabby submissive (take your pick).

You write extremely well and have done some superb stories, but you duck the lesbian fidelity issue -- a serious one -- by making hubby a rigidly stuck stick who thinks "forsaking all others" is clear, unambiguous, and absolute in all degrees and respects, and then not laying on him him the obvious difficult choices that rise from such literalism and inflexibility. And you duck the aftermath issues by throwing your wife away with a few phrases almost before she's hung her clothes back in the closet.

Don't do that to any of your stories -- they and the characters deserve better!

MY CAPS LOCK IS STUCK HELP I SMOKE FAT COCK FOR THE LOVE OF GOD I TAKE IT IN THE CORNHOLE PLEASE HELP MY CAPS LOCK

What you really lose in adultery is TRUST. Good job, message received.

The impact associated with the subject matter holds our interest, though the dialogue is weak... five stars without a doubt

...bill

A little abrupt but well done and to the point - trust is vital lose it and the realtionship is over - very nice/

Was there another option after the psychiatrist took advantage of her - probably - she was a victim that time and she likely, truly needed professional help from a real professional not a vulture who abuses her. But he does not need to play that game too if he chooses not to.

He did good though - gratz to him - I think.

It ended as well as it could, I think, under the circumstances. A very difficult sexual act to get women (or homosexual men) away from. I am a mental health nurse and have run into a lot of similar situations. Right now I can say that I would not mind my wife of GF to be with another woman but until faced with it I might not be so blase.

a Marriage Counsellor lost her licence because she inveigled a husband into cheating with her, after he and his wife went to her to try to save their marriage, damaged as it was by his cheating.

A good, 5* read.

go where no man can go. TK U MLJ LV NV

Good writing, healthy plot! A pleasure to read.

hubby need to worry about his next wife.

Some years ago a Maryland man lost his wife and children to their parish preist who was also a liscensed marriage councilor. He was the guy the diocese sent couples to when they had marriage problems. The preist was defrocked and voluntarily gave up his liscense in Maryland but he took his stolen family to Virginia where apparently they live today. So yea shrinks and councilors are as bad as anyone else.

I hate fucking cheaters. The cunt turned out to be a full lesbian and with that revelation took down her family and her lover, who lost her happy home and profession. A more selfish woman does not exist. Fucking cunt.

to trust a bi slut...NO....anyone knows BI man/women are worst type of mate, and a Bi councilor is just icing on the piece of shit human cake.

....to slam bisexuals in general. I'm bisexual and am a damned good husband, if I may say so myself.

Your comment is so full of sanctimonious, self satisfied, smug, bullshit. What a ludicrous pendant you are. You should read what you have written yourself and correct you own poor grammar. You idiot, you make yourself look foolish. Let's see one of your stories and we'll see how that measures up?

Thanks for the offering.

I went to UNLV and I can tell you Las Vegas is a flake magnet, so naturally the place is crawling with sodomites. They'll all fuck anything with a hole, so how the hell can you differenciate some of them as bi?

With delicate spelling sensibilities; please excuse my use of the Italian version of differentiate.

so he does know the difference between a hole and a pole. TK U MLJ LV NV

She supposedly "loves" her husband, and gets him to take her back.

Now KNOWING how he feels about her lesbian affairs she actually starts up again?

Frankly, her son should have told her to take a hike.

At a minimum, I would think that she should be excluded from family events if their father is going to be there.

Another story of a stupid cheater who wanted the safety and comfort of her husband and the enjoyment of something on the side. Man or woman, who cares, cheating is cheating is cheating. The guy should have never taken her back after the first time. I don't know why she cried, she got what she wanted...just without the safety net. Thanks for another good story.

Another story of a stupid cheater who wanted the safety and comfort of her husband and the enjoyment of something on the side. Man or woman, who cares, cheating is cheating is cheating. The guy should have never taken her back after the first time. I don't know why she cried, she got what she wanted...just without the safety net. Thanks for another good story.

“I know that you take your wedding vows very seriously and Grace lost track of that fact” – You mean, Grace DOESN’T take her wedding vows very seriously?

And just because there is greater acceptance of the gay lifestyle doesn’t make homosexual cheating any less unfaithful.

“she felt comfortable with the psychiatrist who had agreed to do more psychotherapy with her even though it wasn't her field” – Kind of suspicious, especially with a psychiatrist who seems to have a more casual attitude towards wedding vows.

He has the shrink on all sorts of ethics violations. Simply the affair with a client is probably grounds to lose her license or at least a suspension, her lying to him about his wife’s position just adds fuel to the fire.

Re: Privacy laws – let me see, his wife is REPEATEDLY cheating on him after SWEARING she would never do it again, the shrink is having sex with a MARRIED client, and we’re supposed to give a rat’s ass about their “privacy”?

While the son obviously can't "divorce" his mother, he should obviously take GREAT care regarding any influence she might have with their children.

And as KarenE said, his father should definitely be given preference at family events if he doesn't want his ex there.

I truly enjoy your stories. This one was also original. Fantastic job

It's not a matter of her cheating with another woman or women - it's a matter of her cheating. Not every marriage vow includes monogamy (mine do), so as long as both parties agree and abide by the same rules (vows), there shouldn't be a problem.

In this story, the vows included forsaking all others and that means ALL others, not just people of the opposite sex. We don't get to change the rules willy-nilly without FIRST telling our partner and procuring their agreement, that's not how a marriage works. It's got nothing to do with hetero, homo, or bi - it has everything to do with betraying your partner.

A lot of these stories goes into the wife's concern about "losing her attractiveness." Unless she's planning on attracting someone, why should she care about her attractiveness? As long as she still attracts her husband, she's all set!

"I know that you take your wedding vows very seriously and Grace lost track of that fact and she's having to pay for it." - I have to paraphrase what I said in an earlier comment, does she mean that Grace doesn't take HER wedding vows seriously?

"When we got together she suggested we act out some of the things I did with Clara" - So the doctor, who KNOWS she already has an issue with lesbianism, decides to seduce her? And make no mistake, that "act out some of the things" was a seduction, it had NOTHING to do with "treatment!"

Can’t anyone else see that? Matt Moreau and Winterfrog get a lot of shit (and they deserve it) but this clown’s just as bad. All his stories have shitty-ass endings. Fucking 1 star

Agena makes grammatical errors in bushel basketfuls. But the story plots always fascinate me. But he roasted a psychiatrist in this story. And that made my day. I have a family member who is a marriage counselor who tells me that his priority is to save the marriage. One person is already wanting to save the marriage, so the counselor's job is to convince the desenter to agree to compromise and come back into the marriage. So, the one being crapped on will have to accept they will continue to be crapped on.

Most of Agena's stories have good plot lines, but they lack emotional punch because they all too often end abruptly.

In this story, there's a big build up to him catching her cheating again, he has her served, and - poof - the story's over. We don't hear from the wife at all. Where's the passion and emotion? -JRZ

You know Oprah Winfrey Could very well be the Next President of the United States!... If She is I wonder if She will give away free Hospital operations "Everyone who has to have an operation will gather in a studio and She will make a bucket load from it being Televised to Everyone" Smart Woman!!!

Story is Smart also!★★★★★ WOOF!

I like that. I think I like that woman about as much as the protagonist of this story does. But about the story: As someone else said, I thought it was a pretty good story, but the ending was rushed to the point of being nonexistent. And that’s too bad. A lot of pretty good writers here have the same problem. They put a lot of work into the setup and the building towards the ending, and then it’s “Wham bam, Thank you Ma’am”, and that’s it. Problem is, that’s not the way it is in real life. There’s always an aftermath. And many times that’s as compelling as the rest of the story. And too many authors here cheat themselves and their readers by ignoring that. ‘D’

What this got to do with Oprah? Was there ever any show you described?

Another thing is that "Alienation of Affection" lawsuit works only in a few states and it is generally hard to win. Thus this standard cliche used on literotica is obviously hogwash in terms of real legal impact.

Nevertheless I do like this story, it makes sense to a degree and it probably happens more often (wife leaving husband for another female) but it is probably more likely when a male is abusive in some way. The hero in this story does not have any character on display which is a weakness of LW male writers. I mean their male characters are generally no-fault-no-character people like they do not exist in real life.

I know it is hard to develop a character but that is where there is a difference between good and bad writing.

is how utterly stupid they really and truly are.

what are the two things that prevent a suspicious spouse?

why that would be love and trust. what happens when that love and trust begin to erode? why that means the ONLY advantage a cheater has, disappears.

i had a cheating ex/sociopath. they thought they were so damned clever. they thought i was so damned nice too. but love and trust. they weren't smart, and i loved them a lot less after the first betrayal. catching them a second time was child's play. and i made it a POINT to tell them how utterly stupid they actually are...and how utterly un-loving and selfish they are. because like the forgiving idiotic husband, i was willing to give my partner a second chance. and i told them, 'if you can't handle a relationship with me, just say so. i'll dump you in a heartbeat. i need honestly from you." but like a cliche' cheater, they wanted it all. oh....and i got legendary mean. my ability to spin a tapestry of colorful words only gets better the angrier i get. and i was yellow stone park world ending volcanoe levels of done with the drama and bullshit by then.

Friend came home early and caught wifey in sack with neighbor woman..PRESTO 2 divorces...

The marriage wouldn't work, hell you couldn't trust her with a girls night out, nevermind with another man. He should thank ofrah (lol) without her she would be still carrying out lesbian affairs behind his back. God what a slut, 2 affairs in such a short period of time.

Since when does the genders of the lovers make a difference in the LW category?

Whoa...

I know this is what i ight have stated earlier...but i do like the way you write.

I can never understand why would you waste even a single second more that what 'the law' requires.

Cheaters can never get over with the thrill of 'it' by therapy and/or counselling.

Just 'burn' them and move on...

However, I cannot emphasise more, you do write beautifully.

Thank you.

The story was so worthless on so many levels that I hated myself for wasting the time on it.

One thing that I despise is the old stupidity about alienation of affection legal actions -- they don't exist and any story that includes that is crap.

So it the crap of losing a license. That would be a problem if if there was a doctor-patient relationship, but that seemed to have ended before the affair.

Finally, the wife is a lesbian. That may be a reason to divorce, but the author seems to believe that lesbianism is a choice which we all know is retarded.

Six US states have alienation of affection laws! Plus it is fiction!

Crap, nothing new or unexpected, husband is whiter then white and then completely destroys all around him, just crap

Thanks. I'm happy to see that a few others still view 'forsaking all others' still means ALL OTHERS. Our society has taken a serious, degrading hit by the flippant views of marriage vows and adultery. This is fiction, but the meaning is still there. There are a few states that still allow alienation of affection. Also, sexuality is mostly genetic; but for some it's a choice. I've met those through one of my sibling who's a lesbian and takes her vows seriously also.

Sadly and shamefully, our profession does have some monsters out there who use manipulate intimate bond between patient and therapist to extract sexual favor. It is such a disgusting violation of ethics not to mention the damage done to the victim.

Honestly, i have a different view of this story because i believe the wife was victimized. She cheated but that (insert worst female insult) of a psychologist preyed Grace, her fears, lack of self esteem etc. The marriage was probably irreconcilable after the bitch got her hooks in the wife but not necessarily. I couldn't fault the husband for packing it in though.

Such a shame.

Someoneother, depends on the state. There might be a lawsuit for the husband depending on where they live. The wife definitely has one

Read both of you comments on these. Your just as morally corrupt as the head shrinker. Losing her license was the least of it. she should have been jailed. But really why even try and discuss this with you. You are just a waste of time.

As our protagonist said " cheating is cheating"

There is a reason they are called a soft science. 90% of what they do is all bullshit for weak minded people or providing “excuses” dressed up as diagnoses for their actions. If people actually kept their word and took responsibility for their actions this profession would almost dry up.

As for cheating with the same sex.......cheating is cheating is cheating. Cheat at the slit get buried with it.

Only lost her license......she is a degenerate and based on her position should have been charged and done time as a sexual predator. Useless piece of shit.

I,d sooner my wife enjoyed sex with a woman than a man if she wants a little 'strange', perhaps I can watch lol

I've always wondered whether a wife, or husband, has ever been sued for breach of contract? The wedding vows form part of a legal contract just like any other business contract and therefore it should be possible to sue a wife, or husband, for breaching that contract.

What’s with this penchant in LW stories to refer to marriage as an “investment”? Why is it only used as an argument against the cheated one? If it is an investment, then doesn’t the cheated one have a fiduciary responsibility to remove his/her investment from an underperforming security and place it in a safe haven until a better vehicle is identified?

Isn’t it in fact the cheater that treats his/her marriage as an investment when he/she withdraws that which was deposited in trust and gives it to a competitor thus impoverishing both partners and the incorporation itself? How can this be an argument to stay yoked to the cheater?

What sayest thou LW readers?

LWlurker

Automatic one star reduction because of the stupid lw author habit to give away the house. NOBODY DOES THAT. Also, it has been well established that any good listener, whether good friend, pastor, respected elder , whatever can do just as well as these bullshit counselors, psycho babble professional and whatever. They do not hav a magic ear or speak magic words.

You should know that the name is Oprah which you correctly used once in your narrative. But you consistently called her OFRAH. I'm assuming of course that you were referring to the TV personality Oprah Winfrey.

Written by a Neaderthal for Neanderthals... And if Neanderthals still existed, I'd beg their pardon for insulting theie ancestors so harshly...

Ofrah Winprey

Thank you...

I thought the story line was good. What bothers me are the idiots that read our stories, then write stupid comments. They also love to 'assume' things that are wrong, not intended or just plain stupid. There was no

slander or libel. I am sure there was a TV show on this topic, and am sure there were women watching that pick up on the ideas participants were suggesting. Cheating with a woman is probably a lot easier than cheating with a man. Well done. Keep writing.

XYZ

Ofrah? :)

Learn how to spell!

A thin and generic story... he should have gotten far more than $100k from the psychiatrist for her seduction of his wife... like $2M plus her loss of license... kind of a lazily put together story.

Ofrah. Love it.