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Who Cares Where a Page Breaks?

byA_Bierce©
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Comments (19)
by Anonymous

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by luedon03/02/18

Well said, sir

I'm with you all the way. Unfortunately, my approval will probably increase the disapproval expressed by others.

Philistines.

Lue

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by Anonymous03/02/18

just muy thoughts

It all starts with this question in my opinion: "Why am I here?". To read interesting stories. Thus as long as it doesn't get too bad, I don't care if there are a few minor spelling or grammar issues. With a few exceptions they don't distract although I have seen a story or 2 that became unreadable. I would prefer the authors to focus on the story and the proper development of it, rather than spend hours finding the last spelling error or where the page breaks might or might not fall. I am more disturbed by stories that are rushed or by series where the author doesn't seem to be able to wrap it up and deviates to a totally different category.

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by dragonmann7203/02/18

A_Bierce

Understanding your frustrations came easy to a slow learner like me. I read for the fun and miss most problems in stories as my mind controls all of that and for some reason I get the same conclusion as everyone else.

When I try to write I find I have trouble with writing dialog. I can't carry on a decent conversation with myself much less write one for two or more people. The one thing I have noticed though is that stories with a lot of dialog have lots of extra spaces separating each sentence making the story seem longer.

When I copy over a story I like and save it to my memory I do it in 18, it is amazing how a story done in 12 goes from 5 pages to 31.

I liked your story both ways but your other story scared the shit out of me. Continue to write how you feel not others.

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by Anonymous03/02/18

I think you have to 'consider the source' when it comes to your critics.

You write to entertain, and I love your stories. Literotica is free, and the only time I complain is when a truly pathetic, vulgar, trashy, and unbelievable story is posted. There are many great writers on this site, and you're one of them. Please don't let the naysayers discourage you.

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by sbrooks103x03/02/18

Breaks

As we discussed via email, your example of where you would have liked a page break works quite well with the bold type with extra spaces before and after.

You said you had issues with having to break the flow of the story to hit the "Next" button, since you use your mouse wheel to scroll down the Lit page. As I told you, I, and I assume many others, use the Page Down button on our keyboards, so clicking on "Next" isn't really an issue.

I'll have to check out the newly formatted version!

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by kimi199003/02/18

Sadly, your rationale makes zero difference.

In fact, it's an irrational rationale, if that is possible. It is poppycock. Do you, somehow, imagine that ending a chapter and continuing it the next day improves the "flow" of a story, but clicking "next" harms the flow of a story? That's the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard. It is obvious to anyone without your bizarre fetish that breaking a story for 24 hours cannot possibly improve "flow." It ruins "flow."

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by prinnavea03/02/18

Litierary writing form

AB,
I for one don't give a crap about page breaks, paragraph indents or double spacing, clicking to next screen of story, ect, ect. I do care about spelling when it is so bad I have to re-read the line to see what it conveys. Quotations that might be missing in a conversation and how the story flow. I can't even get a short story published because of Lit's punctuation guides and sentencing structure in dialogues. Now that said.

Please, please, please, please, please, please, ok enough begging, do not go anywhere and continue publishing here. I have really enjoyed your stories, even 'Depression Is.' You are in my top 3 fav authors out of 18. I commented on the last 2 chapters because I am born bred country boy because of my views on life, although my music tastes don't reflect that. But I really enjoyed C&W it just went different than I was expecting. It is YOUR story and that is the way you intended it to end. So kudos to you! Keep writing.

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by luedon03/02/18

Interesting comments

I thought it was good to see several of the LW commentariat following AB across to a different category to continue the conversation.

Those who say they don't care about things like small spelling and grammar errors, or layout and flow of a story, probably also don't notice when these things are done especially well. They don't notice that they are enjoying it more.

I wonder if they would say the same thing if they were simply reading a story for genuine enjoyment?

One reason why I now rarely read LW stories is because I find myself reading as a critic rather than as a normal reader. I am not simply reading for enjoyment.

I suspect that most of those among the LW commentariat are doing the same. The LW culture makes it difficult to avoid thinking about what you might say in the comments.

(I do wonder about the technique often employed by SBrooks when he notes down his comments on the way through reading the story. Can someone really do that when reading a story for the simple enjoyment of reading?)

I can't enjoy a story when I am thinking like that, and there are few LW stories which are so well written that they cause me to read simply for the enjoyment of reading. It is clear from the LW commentaries that many (most?) commenters are also reading as critics and not just to enjoy reading an erotic story.

Compare the comments made on LW stories with those made in other categories. They are made with different mindsets.

Lue

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by Axelotto03/02/18

These wankers are complaining about free beer

No matter how much experience they have, they get no credit at all bitching about free. They want to go long? Shit hot, let THEM go long. It's an erotic stories site, not an MFA program in writing.

As for style choices like page breaks as punctuation, I'm a content-over-style writer/editor myself, but nobody's paying me to edit here, so go nuts, do as you want to. I preferred reading your story all at once, but i enjoyed reading it as it came out, too. As a reader, I enjoy what you put out.

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by Anonymous03/08/18

Your flow argument is a red herring

If the story has multiple chapters you have to scroll down the page and then select the next chapter. If there are more than 5 chapters, you have to click to view the next 5 (and so on) to select it. The other option is to go to the author's page and select the next chapter. Both of those interrupt the flow way more than selecting Next.

Many of the readers on Lit and other sites probably enjoy reading and regularly read many different things. These readers likely have average or above average reading comprehension and retention. Hitting next is not going to interrupt their concentration any more than turning a physical page. These readers can probably read a lpage in less than 10 minutes. There's not enough content in short pages to make the effort worth it.

Authors writing small chapters with cliff hanger endings is becoming more common on many sites, not just Lit. This tactic is rewarded on other sites with high download counts and scores, thus driving the behavior. This overall short page behavior may be driven by society's "sound bite" attention span. What's worse is posting once a week with a 10 minute segment, again not worth it as a reader.

I would prefer to read a story that draws me in. Things that don't distract, like punctuation, don't bother me personally. What matters more is can the story draw me in. Judging from the comments, there are probably many readers who can and want to become immersed into the story and would rather have multi-page stories.

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by FD4503/09/18

Who Cares Where a Page Breaks?

Answer: Obviously the majority of your audience.


That being said, there are two things here. One is where Lit arbitrarily puts page breaks. It is NOT THE FAULT OF THE AUTHOR if the second 'page' only has two words. He submits and they chop it up on their format (but their format is rather long...just saying)

But there is also a matter of CONTENT.

Would I prefer a one page masterpiece by oshaw like 'The Cost' versus a horrible, bad, miserable really really awful story like JPBs 'The Wedding Planner'?

Of course. A good story is a good story (or more likely 'scene' but hey, youtube!)

HOWEVER, when we are talking about a MULTIPLE CHAPTER offering, and I get one page of nibblets, WELLLLLLL....

**That is not the fault of Lit.** That, sir, is a choice.


The ability to learn is predicated upon one mental acknowledgement: "I might be wrong" or "There might be something I don't know." Or even "Maybe I am not as brilliant at this pacing thing as I originally thought."

AHEM!

But obviously you aren't wrong. Nope. All the people who are telling you that your artistic reasons are not sufficient for them to totally enjoy the story are ALL blatantly wrong. Every one. Even the accomplished ones.

And this is actually true. As the artist, you get your control over the creation.

But if, like 'Piss Christ' you find that you have far less of an audience than you feel you deserve, the responsibility of not attracting the audience also...lays...on...ahem.

I liked most of what you did. I did not find the 'flow' of the story that you defend so vehemently added to the story. In fact, it subtracted from it. But I would rather you keep writing in those tiny installments than you stop.

So there IS that.

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by luedon03/10/18

Unfortunately, FD45

The current procedure for submitting stories no longer provides the author with the final layout of his or her story.

When I wrote my earlier stories in MS Word, and then converted them to the Literotica layout, I could see the whole story as it would appear to readers, page breaks and all. It was great. Unfortunately, this is no longer the case and I had no control with my last story.

I quote no lesser authority than the late Douglas Adams who wrote his stories on an Apple Mac, which he loved because he could control how each page would look in the printed product.

(The Hitch Hiker's Guide was first written as a radio play, so script layout there was critical. As a sentimentalist, I would like to think the new one soon to run on the BBC was also written on an old Mac.)

Lue

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by FD4503/10/18

Honestly

I never paid much attention to the actual layout of my stories, occasionally (IPO 2 and Rec 2) to the detriment of my audience.

So A_Bierce hasn't made any mistakes I have not made myself.

Since then, I have not submitted anything, but if I did, I would be mindful, if I could arrange it, to submit the story in no less than 5,000 word chunks, if not more.

In general, the 'sweet spot' on Lit seems to be 3 page chunks or no more than 6 page stories.

There are exceptions. They are also exceptional stories (see DSQ, Longhorn, Josephus etc.)

The question isn't one of layout. This is a red herring. No one complained about there being a two word ending on a chapter. (I have read such stories. Yes it was jarring. But it really wasn't the author's fault)

It is one of content and pacing.

His work has a lot of very good potential. But for someone who is 'open to criticism', when your audience tell that they hate Jar Jar Binks, it is a certain type of stupid to continue to have that fecal load continue to grace your movies.

So the question now is if A_Bierce is smarter than George Lucas. I am betting he is.

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It’s your damn story

Write it however the heck you want. You’re not writing for money, so the most important customer to please is you. Advice freely given by others is worth exactly what you paid for it. I hope you’re fixin’ to get around to writin’ some more quick!

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by gatorhermit04/16/18

I like your stories AB and the page breaks don't bother me at all

Besides, both my iPad and iMac (pre-Jobs-departure-vintage) have readers, which I generally use. Please disregard the Nattering Nabobs of Negativism to quote Spiro Agnew.

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by Anonymous04/17/18

AMerryman

This is a strange experience for me, commenting on what isn't a story.

As a reader, doing this just for my enjoyment. It usually doesn't matter where a page breaks. I can retain the (ahem) flow. Just go to the next page. The rare exception is when it is the end of the post. In the middle of action or a dramatic moment. That is disconcerting. It isn't a problem when I can just go to the next chapter.

The significant difficulty for me is when there is NO NEXT CHAPTER❗

Waiting for a few days isn't too bad. Unfortunately, more than a week . Major bad.
I read for the fun of it. Constantly, non-fiction books , paper and electronic. Fiction books again, paper and electronic. News, science, etc, on my "Flipboard " service on my phone . On, and on, and on. I don't know if others have the problem with "flow" or what I call continuity. Much passed a week and I have to go back , read the story over and get the continuity of the characters and plot back.

Anyway, my understanding is that this is a much more serious problem for the writer.
You the writer have your plot going, the characters just so, and the emotions are pitched right on point....then literotica breaks it up without any thought or care. Damn,I would be pissed😖😡.

So I guess my point is, yeah go to another site. If they treat you better post there.
I understand from other writer's comments that SOL.net is very good for writers.

Thanks for the time.
Good writing!!


AMerryman

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by Bearcatfozzy04/20/18

Different experience

I've learned through reading that lpages are a certain length and where they occur in a story is somewhat arbitrary. As a reader, devices like visual breaks (e.g. Series of asterisks, etc.) is helpful to denote changes in flow. I find difficulty when Lparagraphs are too long as it is more difficult to read on many devices. I too have been burned by multi-chapter stories that are never finished by the author, so these days I refrain from reading until I can ascertain that all chapters have been posted. For example, over a year ago txtalltales posted a few installments about a story about "honor" in the title- story installments received very high scores but he never posted final chapter so we never found out how story ended and, ultimately, wasted a lot of time. For this reason, I find it helpful if, in first installment, author states up front how many installments are planned and when he plans on finishing. Some authors finish story completely then post story on consecutive days (that is nice, a treat to look forward to) while others post installments as they complete them which is problematic for two reasons - first, little or no guarantee that story will ever be finished and, second, sometimes too much time elapses between installments (I know, authors have lives too!) so I often have to reread previous installments especially if there are a lot of important details or characters. Just my 2 cents...

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by Anonymous06/06/18

I agree with A_Bierce

Commenting anonymously to try to avoid the flames.

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by Anonymous06/12/18

Agree

I've had them break a page right before the ending and trash my flow before too.
And what is the formula for when they are going to double space? End of a paragraph? End of a sentence? Totally random?

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