All Comments on 'An Open Marriage'

by milfwife

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  • 57 Comments
swingerjoeswingerjoealmost 10 years ago
A solid ***

The concept is exciting, but I feel the execution could have been better. The dialog, especially, felt unnatural. For example: "I felt several waves of cum splash against my quivering ass." That's fine if it is told from a narrative perspective, but people simply don't talk like this in real life.

The "moral of the story" at the end also seemed off-putting. Why does the narrator regret what happened? When you propose an open marriage, you should expect that your wife will fuck other men. It seems like the only reason he proposed it in the first place was so that he could fuck around. And because he didn't get any, it now seems "unfair." I felt very little love between the two main characters. They seemed resentful of each other throughout the story.

The phrase "be careful what you wish for" definitely applies to this story. In fact, it would have made a good title.

Concritic123Concritic123almost 10 years ago
He got what was coming to him.....

The guy was selfish and self centered. It was all about his needs. It sucked for him when his little experiment went haywire and she got more out of it than he did.

AnonymousAnonymousalmost 10 years ago
I Guess

We all know that the 'Careful What You Wish For' syndrome hit this guy with full impact.

It doesn't appear that he once thought about how he would feel about her being with a man,,,note - not another man - I don't see him as a man.

Well, I'm reasonably sure that she'll find another man or two and end up telling him that the 90 days was his idea for a trial and now she likes it so as far as she is concerned, they have an open marriage.

Of course, he's a fool and like money...soon separated from it (alimony) and a wife he took for granted!

Oh, doesn't seem as though he is getting any - jerks usually don't!

Thanks for a good read!

AnonymousAnonymousalmost 10 years ago
I remember that situation

My 2nd wife asked me that, if we could try an open marriage. I didn't mind, she had some cute girl friends. So I thought it was great.

Then I found out why she asked.

She already was busy with a few.

AnonymousAnonymousalmost 10 years ago
Why do these things end up negative? It could have been good for both of them.

Why not have the outcome be positive? Either because it revs up their marriage or because he gets laid too or that they keep things together and open. Some couples make the transition in real life. My wife and I have.

AnonymousAnonymousalmost 10 years ago
One of the Best

Such a hot story. Tremendous.. I loved the tit fucking details and how the cum splattered all over her neck and face. Seriously, well done. A hot open marriage story. Keep writing.

starmanfivestarmanfivealmost 10 years ago
This is the perfect

cautionary tale. Be careful what you ask for!!

MitchFraellMitchFraellalmost 10 years ago
Really?

We all assume that what she told him was actually true. Then again many divorces are by couple who simple fall out of love with each other.

AnonymousAnonymousalmost 10 years ago
Awareness

It is so funny when men think that they are gong to score all this strange pussy in an open relationship. The women always have been and always will be the driving force in an open marriage. They will always get laid if they want to, no so for the men.

swingerjoeswingerjoealmost 10 years ago
Re. "The truth hurts"

I'm guessing your line of business must be either marriage counseling or a divorce lawyer. I can't imagine what other line of business would deal with couples in an open marriage. If that's true, then your "sample" is self-selecting, which makes your opinion worthless.

If your relationship is in trouble, swinging/open marriage certainly won't fix it. Only couples with a strong, healthy and loving relationship should ever even attempt it. And if you are a marriage counselor or divorce lawyer, I'm guessing you haven't met many couples like that.

If open marriages truly were as toxic as you suggest, then there wouldn't be many couples in an open marriage. And there are a LOT of them.

AnonymousAnonymousalmost 10 years ago
A low score here is not surprising but not warranted either.

I hope that you anticipated a backlash about your ending because you know that most people involved with or fantasizing about swapping and open marriages must believe it is all fun or, at the least, harmless. In the real world it may be loads of fun but it isn't harmless-not for most people. Much of these scores derive from a theme's popularity & acceptance.

But please KEEP WRITING. Your skill in the art of storytelling is improving and will continue doing so as long as you keep working at it. Craft-wise, you proofreading is very poor. Please remember that a spell checking or auto correction program not only isn't perfect but they can work against you: These programs don't know enough about punctuation to be really helpful and may, when you aren't looking, change a critical word on you. For instances, I know you meant to say: "my wife can boast" instead of "my wife can best" at the end of the story. You might try read your stories out loud to yourself and mark your punctuation so the story flows. And perhaps you can solicit an editor. Thanks for sharing. DOUG out

gordo12gordo12almost 10 years ago
Re: the truth hurts

You're so full of shit it's not funny. Fact is every research on swinging and alternative lifestyles has shown greater satisfaction, less divorce and happier couples.

IronDragonIronDragonalmost 10 years ago
RE: The Truth Hurts

Well, I can see how the Anon has a point, since my wife works as a divorce/child advocacy attorney. The vast majority of the cases she has handled have dealt with alternative lifestyles gone wrong, in fact. One of them had the cuckold Hubby actually saying NO to the Bull when he was ordered to clean Bull's dick after sex, and got the shit beaten out of him for his trouble. The Divorce happened because Wifey took Bull's side in the whole mess.

I have no idea where gordo is getting his or her "facts" from, but I recommend not believing those alternative lifestyle websites that quote fictitious "facts" to try and lure people in. In a small Midwestern town, you can bet your ass that people in the Bible Belt would definitely frown upon a cuck/hotwife/bull relationship. I grew up part of my life in the Midwest. If you don't think your neighbors are judging you, you're deluding yourself.

I've said it before, and I'll say it again. Monogamy doesn't have to be boring. If you have to bring other people in to help "spice up" your marriage, you're doing something wrong, IMNSHO.

But hey, if you have no imagination or self-respect, and it works for you, more power to ya.

Just my twenty cents. Damned inflation!

As for the tale itself, I didn't read it, so I don't care. The comments are very interesting, though.

Unrated.

AnonymousAnonymousalmost 10 years ago
Could We Raise the Tone Bit?

The comments on this interesting story have rapidly descended to the adolescent.

Pity-it's a worthwhile subject. The flat assertion followed by flat denial so common in blogs doesn't help to enlighten or persuade.

The only three pieces of statistically representative research I have seen in the past ten years relate to the US, Canada and the UK. All three suggest that divorce/break-up rates among couples who decide to have open relationships are, in fact even higher than the disastrously high rates of divorce in those three countries. The main reasons given are, firstly, that the types of people who agree to have open relationships are often (but not, of course, always) those for whom commitment to one person is less important than average. Secondly, if your spouse/partner goes on looking around long enough there is a substantial risk that they'll find someone that they prefer to you.

Both of these reasons seem to accord with common sense.

There may well be other pieces of research that show the opposite. Perhaps one of the previous commenters would like to give us specific references.

Incidentally, what odds would you give that the wife in this story will not have sex outside the marriage again? She did it-she loved it. Have the odds of this marriage ending in divorce increased or decreased? Pretty obvious isn't it?

AnonymousAnonymousalmost 10 years ago
re: gordo12

Would you mind stating where you got your facts? I don't believe them. If anybody is full of shit, guess who it is? Plain common sense suggests that open marriages are trouble.

Annette74Annette74almost 10 years ago
Glad you learned

The old saying, "if you can't stand the heat get out of the kitchen" really hits home here. I know and have known lots of guys who wanted an 'open marriage' and met the same fate or worse. Nice story xoxo Annette

AnonymousAnonymousalmost 10 years ago
my personal opinion

I have found that in the two relationships I've had where we had sex with others that the most thrilling moments by far have been the nights she's had sex with another man in front of me, and yes I've joined in as well but just watching was the best. I do not consider myself a cuckold, quite the opposite actually, but we'll see to that in a moment. I find it most erotic seeing my lover pinned to the bed, backseat, or ground by a younger more robust man. My current lover is on birth control and we've had sex with only two other partners one being a close friend I've shared women with for years and the hottest moments by far have been the ones where she's filled with hard cock, moaning and writing in ecstasy in front of me, and then when the guy say's he going to cum, and where should he do it at etc... I love seeing her wrap her legs around him and watching as she allows him to unload inside of her (no I do not eat the creampie. I've been down there pretty close after she's been nailed and that part doesn't appeal to me. I did suck her clit once but the thought of what I'd just seen kinda freaked me out lol.) but I do love fucking her when she's filled with cum. There's this physiological thing that happens where her pussy actually gets much tighter and the shape of the penis is actually to pull any other sperm from the vagina so ones own may be deposited and the friction of this action is amazing, in our case anyway. My friend is married btw and his wife is totally cool with him fucking my wife. We've had a blast together taking turns filling my wife with our cum and it's quite erotic... and most important it's most fulfilling for her... he is respectful of her limits and does not try to push them and in exchange she sucks his hard cock and let's him cum into her mouth (soimetimes she swallows his jizz, but most times she spits) but she always gets the first load in her pussy. My wife is very tight and shaved and she loves it when I watch her get fucked and then finger her smooth pussy until she just can't take it anymore and she straddles me and has the most intense ... loud, ... grinding orgasms and we usually cum together in these instances and feel so much closer than we have in awhile and the experience electrifies our relationship... we'll fuck like rabbits for months after... but when we start to argue and thing's are getting stale... I just give my buddy a call (for us usually once every six ot twelve months sometimes longer sometimes a little less... he comes over and we have a few drinks and when the wife starts feeling horny she say's that we can fuck her.... and we do :) and we fill her pussy with jizzz so that when I wake up in the morning she smells like sex and I do her again

- J -

swingerjoeswingerjoealmost 10 years ago
Okay, one more comment

Since everyone else is contributing anecdotal evidence to support their theories, I'll give you my own experience. I know at least 200 couples (likely far more, but I'll underestimate for argument's sake) who are actively practicing an "alternative lifestyle", and I only know of two that have divorced -- and both of those couples had marital issues that would have ended most marriages, traditional or otherwise.

I don't know which studies the anonymous commenter referenced earlier, but I question their conclusions based on my own experience. I do know of the study by the Personality and Social Psychology Review, which found that there is no empirical evidence that people in monogamous relationships fare any better than people in nonmonogamous relationships in terms of happiness, health, sexual satisfaction, emotional intimacy or relationship longevity. (I would include the link here, but I'm sure it's against the rules. Feel free to Google it.)

This point (that has been mentioned repeatedly) about people "frowning upon" alternative lifestyles is irrelevant. I would bet my life savings that IronDragon knows someone who is in the lifestyle, and yet he has NO idea that they are. Of course, there is a social stigma attached to swinging and open marriages...which is why people in those types of arrangements generally don't advertise it! Many of you would be SHOCKED if you knew how many of your friends and neighbors were involved in consensual, extra-marital relationships.

To IronDragon's point, I completely agree that monogamy doesn't have to be boring; and for most people, monogamy is the perfect lifestyle. But it's not for everyone. In fact, I would argue that it's not for MOST people. I think most people have to fight to remain monogamous. They spend their lives unnecessarily burdening themselves with guilt over their secret thoughts and desires. All of that guilt, and the heartache and pain that often comes as a result of failing to fight our natural urges, would be alleviated if we simply acknowledged that it's okay to have sexual desires for other people.

Without a doubt, there are many benefits to monogamy -- otherwise it wouldn't exist. And I'm a huge believer in "social monogamy" -- i.e. making an emotional commitment to one person that involves love and trust and everything else that makes a relationship worthwhile. Sexual monogamy is a different story -- and that's what this story was about. If people could only learn to separate the two, we would all understand each other much better.

Black_Dragon_PrincessBlack_Dragon_Princessalmost 10 years ago
To each their own.........

I will answer this one on behalf of me and my husband because he is editing his book again. swingerjoe we live in southern Cali and we know some peeps who are into swinging and swapping. We are friends with some of them but we reserve ourselves for each other. We have our celebrity threesome lists which are fantasies only with no guilt at all so your sexual monogamy argument about guilt isn't worth much to us hun. We don't differentiate between emotional and sexual monogamy. Its all the same to us. Like he said tho one of my first cases was to represent a man in a divorce against his wife where the other man in the relationship beat him severely so that puts those relationships in a bad light for most people who know about them.

You talk about guilt. What about the guilt that goes with lying to your friends and family who you know would disapprove of your lifestyle? Do your parents know that you and your wife are swingers? How would they react if they knew?

To be honest here, my husband and I are kinda in an alternative lifestyle if you want to get technical, because we are an interracial married couple. Its been shown in several studies that bw/wm swirl marriages last longer than same race marriages on average. I just had to tell him that one too hehe.

I will say the same thing he did....... more power to you on your lifestyle choice and we hope it works out for you in the long run sweetie. ^^

KarenEKarenEalmost 10 years ago
I've Said This Before

I can see only three results from "trying out" another partner:

1) It's not as good as your regular partner.

2) It's about the same.

3) It's better.

In cases 1 and 2, why bother?

And in case 3, how can you now be satisfied with your partner now that you can have someone better?

AnonymousAnonymousalmost 10 years ago
Just thinking

I don't know about 'official' studies etc, but in real life these people are suddenly pariahs (as another comment states, like "leprosy") in a smaller town this cannot be kept secret, friends find they have an important 'engagement' whenever they meet either couple in the mall, people 'dodge' down supermarket aisles to avoid them, they cannot help but hear the whispers and giggles that happen as soon as they leave a lunch room. Their names are suddenly crossed off of lists for social engagements, B-B-Ques etc..(who knows, they could be considering ones spouse) People do not include them in a social setting where they have their families and children present. Men think it is OK to make crude, vile jokes in the women's hearing, thinking that she is always willing to 'spread her legs'. So, the only avenue left for them is to sell up and move probably at a loss, to another city or state. Is it worth it?

greowulfgreowulfalmost 10 years ago
Swinger Joe--do you read or just pick cherries

Joe, I'm assuming you are speaking of the T.D. Conley study that focused on GAY MEN. A few points:

Women will always have the advantage in consensual non-monogamous relationships ("CNM"). I don't care if this comes from social expectations on promiscuity or differences in libido, the fact is a decent looking woman can get laid just by asking, where a decent looking man still has to work for it. Thi presents a power imbalance in nearly *every* heterosexual CNM relationship. Such a power imbalance is very unlijely to lead to a happy and successful relationship.

Second, anecdotal evidence is all we have. It sounds like you are vastly outnumbered in your professed evidence of successful relationships. If a study DID occur, the fact I would be most interested in is how long the CNM relationship lasts. In my younger days, I associated with an alternative crowd (Ren Faire performers, goths, practitioners of alternative religions). So CNM made up a good 25% of those I knew. Not a damn one is still in the same CNM 10 years later. Either they broke up, or became monogamous. My question fo you on your 200 associates is this: how many have been in the same CNM for more than 5 years? I'll bet the number is much smaller than 200.

Whether by social construct or the pheremones involved, it is extremely difficult to separate sex from emotion. If that's the path you choose, good luck with that . . .

TornadoTysTornadoTysalmost 10 years ago
Not A Good Idea !

In a open marriage arrangement the wife will always have the advantage of bedding more partners. Even if she is off average attractiveness simple because most men will fuck any thing on offer. For the husband to succeed he needs to in good shape, reasonably handsome, good in bed with a decent size cock.

Otherwise the wife will win all the time !

AnonymousAnonymousalmost 10 years ago
In 30 years........

@ TornadoTys

1.It may be the beginning of the open marriage, but 30 years long period the husbands could use callgirls...prostitutes.....mistresses at 60 years old too. So the begining advantage will decrease with the time. Only money question.

2. The common open marriage is not indiscrimate partner swap, because the end of this will be STD collection. The spouses tries picky with partners.

3. BTW in high % the open marriages go to divorce with new spouses. A younger wife......

swingerjoeswingerjoealmost 10 years ago
"On Open Marriage and Swinging"

Rather than add another comment here, I've decided to submit an essay. If you're interested, it should be posted within the next few days, and will be titled "On Open Marriage and Swinging."

It's been a really interesting discussion, and I thank the author for providing the spark.

AnonymousAnonymousalmost 10 years ago
My wife

That was hot. I love stories like these.

I'd love for this Rick to take my wife to a hotel or back to his place and fuck her brains out all night like this.

devilspydevilspyalmost 10 years ago
LOL, cuckold's and their "bright" ideas. lol

First to get another woman to fuck a married guy you need to offer something she does not already have. It really helps if your hung like a horse. Cuckold "bright" idea's often backfire because wives can and will use it against them. And last, once a woman finds out "what is out there" she is not about to give it up. So all cuckold's rules are out the window at this point. Rick is leaving but I bet Rick tells a few stud buddies about cuckold's wife and that cuckold is ok with it. She will soon have the pick of dates and on her rules. Cuckold once the horse is out of the barn, little late to want to close the door. LOL Oh, and one of her new rules cuckold is you will not, ever get to fuck another woman. And only your wife if she says so. Don't be surprised when she says after you cum, "are you in yet"? LOL

hardwettalkhardwettalkalmost 10 years ago
Get real

After having read this erotic account of this wife's experience, and not being overwhelmed with joy for her is prudish. The woman had permission from her husband, shes in the latter years of her life and her marriage. What a wonderful thing to have happen to her.

If theirs fault, its with her husband, for not being happy for her. His original offer and his final reaction were rooted in selfishness.

AnonymousAnonymousalmost 10 years ago
A lie

An "open mariage" is adultery, and no longer really a marriage.

stillaonewomanmstillaonewomanmalmost 10 years ago
Found my wife 28 years ago

We dated for two years. When we got married I was recovering and still am, from child abuse. A very severe case of it. I thought I wanted to share my wife with everybody, I didn't think she loved me. She never would. I am happy to tell you We just celebrated our 26th wedding anniversary. I read stories here on literotica to spice up our sex life. I love humiliation stories, but open marriage/swinging/cuckolding don't turn me on. In fact, in most the woman acts like such a bitch, as in this one, that I get angry. I think if anybody is thinking of this type of lifestyle, don't do it. Why do you want to inflict pain upon yourself? That's not a good thing to do. Right now, our sex life is smoking Hot. Let me tell you, everybody who thinks this is the best, go and get your wife back, really back. Make love to her something fiercely, or maybe you need a divorce. If I was a man, and a Bull wanted me to suck him off-oh it would never happen. He would be found dead someplace, either with a gun shot or his privates shoved into his mouth after being tasered to a stand still.

TornadoTysTornadoTysalmost 10 years ago
Not a Good Life Style !

I agree with stillaonewomanm regarding open marriage / cuckold life style.

If a man tried that nonsense with me I would yell I will fuck his wife / GF and inform him that he is now a cuck !

AnonymousAnonymousover 9 years ago
wife watcher

That was hot. I love stories like these. I'd love for this Rick to take my wife to a hotel or back to his place and fuck her brains out all night like this.

I love this type of stories I like to see my wife's pussy filled with big black coke

and fucked her. but I'am not selfish I want they both enjoy sex .

AnonymousAnonymousover 9 years ago

tell a woman that you want another woman, and she will enjoy fucking your friend right in front of your nose.

AnonymousAnonymousabout 9 years ago
Finding Herself

This a true story. I married my high school sweetheart. We dated the last two years of school. Her parents were very religious. We didn't have sex until we got married two years later. she was 19 and I was 20. We were both virgins. Four years later things weren't going very good. She came home from her job one day and said we needed some time apart. She said she was moving in with her 24 year old girlfriend from work. She said she needed to find herself. Two months later I found out what she ment. She needed to find herself being fucked by another guy. We got divorced.

tazz317tazz317about 9 years ago
WHAT THE HELL...YOU NAMED THE GAMES AND SET THE RULES

and just like Professional Wrestling and the WWE you don't like the outcome, TK U MLJ LV NV

rightbankrightbankabout 9 years ago
touche'

how does it feel now mf?

I am surprised she came back to the house.

AnonymousAnonymousalmost 9 years ago
Seriously

You don't have to ask her again...she is going to date and fuck whoever she wants, whenever she wants and...oh, BTW - she no longer has any respect for you...she likes real MEN!!!

vastiesmith2vastiesmith2almost 9 years ago
No one has any respect for you dear annony.

You're areal asshole. gave it a 5

AnonymousAnonymousover 7 years ago
☆☆☆☆☆- (4.55/5.0 = 91% = A) THIS IS A GOOD STORY

The husband all but unilaterally imposed open marriage thing onto his wife. She was too proud to beg him not to fuck other women. She may have thought he was having an affair already. He was basically threatening her with divorce.

She did not to get mad, she got even.

As swingerjoe pointed out, Be careful what you wish for!

NellaBarely2NellaBarely2about 7 years ago
Too close to reality

Shit happens while you're waiting for life to begin. Some times you look back and wish someone had slapped you enough to wake up to realize you had the whole world in the palm of your hand. The smarter ones pause more than once to re-think about stupid "proposals" or knee-jerk reactions. Some times you don't get a second chance. GREAT STORY - can be all too true. Kudos

26thNC26thNCover 5 years ago
F**K you

That's what she said to you, you stupid bastard.

MrKachingMrKachingabout 5 years ago
Hope

I hope she wants some more strange dick and brings you home a cream pie. All her friends should learn you are now a cuckold and she gets fresh dick when ever she wants.

Keep writing more!!!!

AnonymousAnonymousabout 5 years ago
You won't have to

Because, that door is already open, wide open.

gingerhuntergingerhunterover 3 years ago
This marriage is unlikely to survive

Opening a marital relationship to allow sex with others is a high risk, high reward proposition when voluntarily undertaken by both members of a stable couple. The wife is clearly not in favor of the idea when he presents it. The husband should have been more attentive and deferential to her misgivings. It is nonsensical that they made such a huge change in their marriage at the end of one brief, discordant conversation. There's no way this would go smoothly.

His lack of concern for her and his persistence in pursuing his fantasies make the wife increasingly frustrated and angry as time passes. Since the husband had not actually met with anyone her decision to date and have sex with her coworker was a major escalation of the stressors on their marriage. If her primary desire was to convince her immature husband to snap out of his self centered fog, a dinner date without sex would have more prudent. She has now backed him into a corner. He'll have to fuck some other woman to maintain parity in the relationship. Since she certainly won't be any less angry after he does that the situation has a high likelihood of destroying their bond of 25 years. Sad that they have so little heart for each other after all those years.

mrfox_stingermrfox_stingerover 3 years ago
Equality between man and woman

When it comes to dating, women have higher advantage. For short term dating age doesn't matter as long as you she can satify a man. Man on other hand are in huge advantage. He can only access different women if he has the resources. Men are not choosy when it comes to sex but women are.

Anallicker01Anallicker01about 2 years ago

Husband NEEDED to have a woman in the "wings" to prevent wifey getting "a leg up"! Stupid, ignorant man!

The door has been opened cuck! I hope you enjoy the lifestyle!

CARLVPCARLVPabout 2 years ago

My wife decided to have her open marriage wtthout consulting me. She didn’t go out on dates just seized on opertunities randomly when we were not together. First I heard about it is when she caught ride home with classmate from college. Without warning sh blurted out “he fucked me long, so long wounded when he would stop” Finally came in my pussy. Gave me good orgasm. Continued twelve years. I didn’t participate becasuse I require a loving long term relationship before I can get hard.

timrivtimrivalmost 2 years ago

You left it unfinished. Need to finish the story with continuing seeing Rick and staying the nite, going away for a weekend maybe even going on vacation with him while hubby sits at home full of fear of losing his wife. Eventually she files for divorce, moves in with Rick and leaves hubby in the dust alone and wanking off.

AnonymousAnonymousover 1 year ago

D.I.Y. Doormat instructions: (1.) Ask your wife for an open marriage...

ctdansctdansabout 1 year ago

Never again ask for the opportunity to open the marriage? You don't have to! It is now open! Its just she is having better luck than you.

AA82ndAAAA82ndAAabout 1 year ago

Great story. Well written. Finally a writer portrays a guy as stupid as many of the female M/C in this category. Maybe chapter 2 is in order. After a couple of more trysts she can teach this "empty chair" some good sex moves.

the_Otter_guythe_Otter_guy10 months ago

Nice work of fiction. Just a suggestion, bait and switch at the end. She finishes by saying “Is that what you wanted? Well, I made up the story and I was out with my friends. Hopefully that teaches you not to ask for something you’re not ready for!”

lc69hunterlc69hunter10 months ago

Beware of what you ask for

LoisKnight69LoisKnight697 months ago

She was right. He was having a midlife crisis. Turns out he was justified in having it. His wife didn't want him and neither did anyone else. Now he will really be depressed, knowing that a man ten years younger than them, who had a bigger cock found her desirable enough to fuck her brains out all night. He now knows that a desirable man can still turn her on. Her time with threat has confirmed the husband's worst fear, at the absence about good sex life with his wife is because who doesn't excite her.

AnonymousAnonymous4 months ago

Doesn't make any sense to me.

Maybe, she's trying to make her husband a jealous one so that he never dare to mention about opening their marriage.

fredbrownfredbrown2 months ago

Don't believe this, sounds more like a "story" to burn his dumb ass to the ground. My wife comes in after a hot time keeps her mouth shut and leaves IT to my imagination!

Since I know for a fact she do get randy .......

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