All Comments on 'When We Were Married Ch. 04D'

This has really turned into a masterpiece! I hope there is more to come!

I also belive this is one of the best stories I have ever read ....Please continue...but dont make us wait so long for the next installment....

I do not watch chick flicks, I do not read as much as I use to . But I have to tell you Mr. Steele I AM ADDICTED TO THIS STORY

You got me hooked, and this installment (although a little slow) did not disappoint.

Now another dream, and a hint that maybe Debbie's cutting Bill out of her life and lying to him about her nights out to university functions, out with friends, school functions and what not while she was actually out whoring and slutting around, got her used and abused and good old Bill wasn't around to stop it this time and Debbie got pissed and blamed Bill for not being there as I stated before, "DEBBIE CUT BILL OUT OF HER LIFE SO SHE COULD BE A SLUT'', and not have to worry about a guilty conscience.

Mixed emotions about this chapter, it started with Bill sounding kind of wimpy and whiny instead of like the "ANGLE OF DEATH", but maybe got back on track later.

Don't know where its going, but I am along for the ride until the end.

Thanks for the story, and I know its your story, but a little more realism on the damage Bill put upon Dougie would help the concept of a real ass kicking Bill gave out in your original description of the start of the fight. Doug would have been seeing through mere slits between his eyelids as his eyes would still have been almost swollen shut in real life.

Maybe in your next endeavor?

Again I am along for the ride.

Tom

This story is like the perverbial onion - the plot and characters have so many layers that after you peel one away, there is another one below the surface. Like most readers, I have no idea where this will end up and I'm not sure DQS does, either. That being said, I feel there is much more to come in this story so I am not expecting a quick resolution. I have enjoyed the weaving in and out of characters in other stories. Since we know about the foibles of Lew and Mona revealed in another of DQS' stories, we can see what the future portends for characters and certainly other stories help explain some of mind set of people like Cindy. Very, very enjoyable and complicated work!

Having read many stories on this site, unlike many writers who pen their work just to "spin a yarn" - this author has something to say to his readers. How much of this story is real and how much is fiction? Has DQS put such a great effort into it as a catharsis for himself or is it purely for entertainment purposes? We will never know for sure. That being said and paraphrasing a line from the President of UNF, Mr. Steele you must be a very interesting man!

I can only repeat myself again, I would like to read a chapter every day and, when it's finished , read the whole story again and again. I think I'mp addicted too. So please post the next chapters as soon as you can.

Over the past few chapters have been an ongoing debate -somewhat entertaining -- between Harry in VA and size14shoe on whether not Debbie is mentally ill.

Harry provided lots of actual evidence by citing story text her actions words and general behavior.... where as size14shoe seems to think that most of this has been Bills fault since most men are... well evil.... and that nothing's wrong with Debbie except for the fact that she is just Horny.

Debbie's totally unexplainable channeling of her Aunt Clarice outside the courtroom after the divorce was granted a pretty serious prove that Harry IS correct.

She is NUTS.

Moreover if debbie has been suppressing a rape incident from many years ago while she was married... and have never told Bill... or anyone for that matter .... That too was only going to dramatically impact her mental health and stability.

Good chapter.

In a world where really good porridge is scarce, I dare to ask for more.

For the time being, I can see three reasons why Debbie is what she is.

First, she's attractive, hot, sexy, beautiful, whatever adjective you want to give her. Her experiences from being beautiful makes her believe that her beauty and flirting will make men do anything she wants.

Two, her aunt Clarice. Apparently her aunt Clarice went off the deep end after her husband Frank cheated on her, and subsequently poisoned Debbie's mind with "All men are cheating, good-for-nothing bastards, who should all die." This reinforces Debbie's behavior, that men are to be used, and not to get too close to them, because they'll only betray you.

Three, from this chapter we learn that Debbie has been gangraped very badly sometime in the past. Correct me if I'm wrong, but it seemed to have happened during her marriage to Bill, while he was working (probably overtime), and she was out with friends. Her mind can't handle it and suppresses the memory so far that she cannot even remember, only in dreams.

As far as I can tell, THIS is what sets off Debbie's vicious diatribes against Bill and his work. He was working when she was raped. Unlike how they met and hooked up, he did NOT show up to save her, reinforcing aunt Clarice's notion that men cannot be counted on (not to mention the rapists themselves). She blames him and his work that she was raped, and she can't even remember she was raped.

I admit this does put Debbie in a slightly better light to me. Her excessive anger towards Bill's work is unfair, but understandable.

But ofcourse, this does tie in with how Debbie is as a person. Did she flirt too much with the men and they didn't take no for an answer? Did they slip her a daterape drug while she was dancing? Would she have been raped if she had NOT been out clubbing without her husband? There's too little info to go on though.

Anyway, I'll cut this comment short. In all, it was a very enlightening and informative chapter.

The symmetry is good. Bill and Debbie got married after Bill saved her from a gang rape. A gang rape that part of Debbie wanted and that was precipitated when Debbie INTENTIONALLY placed her self in harms way.

Now many years Debbie was attacked again. Maybe he uncontrollable and overpowering sex drive again placed her in another dangerous situation.

This time Bill of course was NOT around. So Bill gets blamed... even if he had No idea that this ever happened.

THAT is when this marriage started to fall apart.

Blaming Bill for XYZ when Bill did not even what XYZ is or when it happened ....is NOT rational.

Debbie has a Mental illness that shows but she is a total slut period. She is a narcissus, which is bad for anyone to be with her full time. She talks about how much she loves when she dances with men who rubs there big dick on her. Her attitude is well I go home with Bill and fuck him don’t I. Well lets turn that around. What if it was Bill who was on the dance floor rubbing up on hot women, would she still be okay with that even though he went home with her and fucks her? What she would really be thinking is that Bill might be with her but his mind is on the other women as he did her. She wonders why he didn’t want to go to any of her social functions with her. How could any man watch his wife acts like a slut in public and just sit there? Hell he is a DA, he can’t jump on everybody that rubs his big cock (as Debbie always states) on his wife and beat him up, as his wife begs for it. She also took Bill’s love and faithfulness to her thinking he was a dumping fat wimp and no other women would want him so she could dump all over him without a worry. She blames him for her sorry marriage, but truth be known it was her. Oh he might be partially to blame by being to tied up in his work but if Debbie used half the effort to get the beautiful Dougie in bed and used it on Bill instead they would still be married.

Now that DQS1 has revealed a crucial plot detail, I would like to share with you a personal note I sent to DQS1 after I read Chapter 4C. I did not get all of the particulars correct, but I did note that Debbie had been raped, repressed it, ands used Bill’s lack of attention and flabby physical appearance as the reason why she strayed. I am sure the authors has more surprises for us reading, and I can’t wait to read what happens next. Its interesting that the rapists wanted no part in having vaginal penetration because they believedthat she was very promiscuous. I wonder whether that is fact or fiction.

PERSONAL NOTE TO DQS1, 8/11/2010

Chapter 4C is a really good chapter, and it clarified a few important points for me. I hope you do find a way for Bill and Debbie to reconcile, although not necessarily before the divorce. I really like the idea of Bill and Debbie divorcing, then building a new relationship from the ground up based on a more realistic assessment of their desires and expectations, and their strength and weaknesses. Your description makes clear (at least to me) that members of this family need counseling, individually and collectively. Debbie needs it most, because it seems that her psychosis ttigged that family’s downfall.

I have repeatedly lied and indicated I would make no more predictions. Well, guess what, I can’t seem to resist. I agree with the good doctor when he indicated that there was a triggering event to Debbie’s intense hatred of Bill. Here is my theory about where you are taking this story and why reconciliation is plausible.

Debbie shows all the signs of having been raped by from 2 to 5 men at a public gathering in which her husband was present. She was lured to a secluded spot by one or more of the men she had been teasing. While she initially objected she eventually gave in and participated in her own rape. This would explain why she did not report the rape because she was not clear in her own mind her role in causing the rape; and she submitted to the rape because the men involved appeared to her as dominant individuals who took what they wanted and she like being submissive to these types of men. This would also explain why she hated Bill because he was not forceful enough with her and at the same time allowed other men to tale liberties with her at parties because she wanted to relive the experience. She repressed the occurrence of the rape out of guilt and shame, but at the same time harber strong resentment and hate toward Bill because she feels he should have prevented the rape, even though he had no idea that the rape was occurring.

ANYWAY, I HAD TO TELL SOMEONE, SO WHY NOT YOU.

Take care

you need not respond

no reconcilaiation but i think he could throw a pity fuck t odebbie occasionally...i think it will come out that she was raped n actually mentally she will never be the same again...without bill fucking her occasionally she will end up going nuts...he will do it just so the kids dont lose their mother...but he will also be fucking maybe 30 other women also...why not hes free now to use his power n position to fuck the best looking n most powerful women in the world ..so why not take advantage of it

I really enjoy your writing not sure the added value to the story of debbies rape but your the writer so I will read on. Please put my vote down foe bill and Debbie getting back together and for the record in my view your writing is probably the best on the entire site. Please keep the chapters coming and take all the comments with a grain of salt. Think of them like the comments from tourists when they see the Mona Lisa. Everyone has one but nobody has the talent to paint it like Leonardo did PS excuse the spelling this is coming from my iphone

Some more mysteries added... some good reveals. My only wish would be to see each chapter more quickly, but bottom line... they ARE worth the wait!

Great job DQS1. Please keep it going.

Wow this chapter was so deep, I mean damn.

Thank you for writing this.

I never spend time thinking about past issues that may have helped make me the jackass I am today, and I never consider it in my dealings with others. It seems Deb had a bad experience and was even told she was too old and skanky to fuck, so they pissed on her and she somehow repressed the memory. Stomping one of her wonderful tits constitutes a capital crime, in my book. My point, I guess is, that I would never have thought to use such a plot device. I just don't think like that, but it seems to be garnering Deb some sympathy and she sure as hell needs large quantities of it. I am already feeling irritated by her working for the public defender, which I always thought did not pay too well. She will have the power to make Bill miserable as she screws her way through the judicial system. This is some story!

And I thought Debbie couldn't have had a worse experience growing up.

`

"Despite my parents' best efforts, I had sex with an 18-year-old boy when I was 12. By the time I was 15 I'd probably had sex with 20 guys, some of them grown men."

`

I'm not a doctor so I can't claim to diagnose mental illness like some commenters here, but in laymen's terms I'd say that Debbie had some things happen to her during her formative years that influenced her behavior as an adult.

Debbie appears to have "made a decision" early in life -- probably when she was as some here would say, a 12 year old slut -- to not tell what is happening to her that should be reported. She didn't tell her parents about the 20 incidences of statuatory rape by the time she was 15, she didn't tell Bill about Kelly and BJ's sexual ahappenings that she likely blamed on herself. She didn't tell Bill about the joyous experience that she most certainly wanted -- being mouth-raped, slapped around and pissed in and on. That traumatic event is suppressed in her subconscience.

`

While I don't think it is necessarily the truth, I do think that her having breasts at 11 could have Debbie thinking that men taking advantage of her was her fault. And the mind would have everything similar to be her fault as well. The problem is when she expresses in the story that something is her fault, we tend to believe her. She should know better than think it was her fault but that isn't the way it always works.

`

While her activities may warrant the disgust and disdain expressed by some anonymous contributers and their always right leader, I feel nothing but sympathy or perhaps empathy for Debbie and a life gone bad. Some say she deserves all the misery she gets. I just don't see it that way. I say she deserves something besides every male she runs into trying to fuck her.

`

I don't expect a reconcilliation at this point. Bill's need to be right about her will prevent any thinking that could possibly soften his hard stance about Debbie. Too bad. Growing old together is what both really want.

This story is so good it's hard to find the best words to describe it. However, some of what's happening now could have been predicted from earlier chapters, e.g., that Debbie would require psychiatric help. But the depth of her mental problem is now being realized.

I was a bit confused about which "Clarice" was married to Frank who left her for a younger women. I had thought that it was Debbie's younger sister Clarice, but I see now that it was Debbie's Aunt Clarice who had committed suicide. So if this is true, why isn't Debbie's sister Clarice in the saga? Did she also die? Is sister Clarice another secret not yet uncover?

It keeps coming up - in this chapter Debbie indicates to us that she was in a tenured position at UNF. No she wasn't and she did not warrant it. DQS says in a prologue to chapter 04A that one of the glitches (slips) was that 'Debbie was an associate professor, not an assistant professor.' Tenure is granted with promotion to associate professor, assistant professor do not have it. If your in academia the promotion to associate professor with tenure is a big deal. I think that what Debbie means is that she was in a tenured track faculty position.

My goodness what a black chapter. Into each life some shit must fall to give counterweight to the good. Seems like everyone got a bucketful here.

I appreciate that you have taken the pages necessary to fill out the characters with their dark sides.

I've been greatly enjoying this story, checking frequently for additions. I have to say that Debbie's had a rough life which obviously affected her, but at the end of the day, who the fuck cares? She's a grown adult and responsible for her actions, which were cold, calculated and cruel. She deserves her present misery and worse. How she can blame Bill for what happened is unbelievable. She can blame him for the failure of the marriage, though she played a significant role as well, but she bares sole responsibility for her actions and the humiliating way she ended things. There seems to be a lot of sympathy for her and hopes of them getting back togather, but I think he'd have to be an idiot to take her back. I hope he settles into something good and stops being faithfull towards a bitch who proved with her actions to be incapable of loving him (or anyone for that matter).

I look forward to each chapter and this one did not disappoint in the least. As others have said, a bit dark, but very well written. My only complaint is that I wish this was a book I had purchased and I could devour it at one sitting, but then I would want more.......

.

Though, as comedy, this works a lot better.

grieving part. hardest part to overcome.

I like this story, with all it's twists and turns. I am glad the divorce has finally occured. Hopefully you will let Debbie and Bill move on with their lives. But I you are still writing about them both having some sort of 'feelings' for each other, whatever they may be so who knows? Anyway keep writing and thanks for the story.

I look forward to every chapter. I hope that your ending will be a happy one for Bill and his now x wife. Maybe now that she is divorced she will see that that was a bit mistake and can heal the breach before it's to late.

Thanks for the story

for the most part I agree with almost eveything you say about Debbie. IF she has been with 10...15...20 different men by the time she is 20... sure she has developed a warped view of the world.

so on THAT point we agree.

BUT when you say " I say she deserves something besides every male she runs into trying to fuck her..."

that is FALSE. And it shows all of us how fucked up your thought process is Phil.

This is a women that came onto Bill's attorney at the first divorce meeting... SOLELY because Debbie thought it would be " fun" to do so.

Debbie has SOME responsibility to Break the cycle here... no?

if she stops thinking that EVERY man who see her the 1st time wants to fuck... then maybe she will run into some men that dont always want to fuck her as soon as they see her...

he isn't there when Lew needed a friend in other story, where was Bill in that? Is he going to die?

To add Harry's second comment, take an example of a very recent event. Debbie begs Clint to come at her place for a pity fuck. She invites the troubles not that every male she runs into wants to fuck her.

"I don't expect a reconcilliation at this point. Bill's need to be right about her will prevent any thinking that could possibly soften his hard stance about Debbie."

I actually agree with most points, but THIS?

Bill's need to be right? Right about what exactly?

What about all the pain Debbie has caused Bill? All the put-downs? Taking a lover? Kicking Bill out of the house? Moving her lover in? Rubbing in the fact that the lover is younger, more handsome, has a bigger cock, is taller, that she has GREAT sex with him at every opportunity?

I'd say not wanting to get back together with Debbie is self-preservation, and not wanting to get hurt and betrayed again.

Most all of the comments so far on this chapter (or is it a piece of a chapter) seem to be positive. To me the story has now turned into "How the Soap Opera Turns." The best thing about this chapter was that the divorce is final and as such the story as an entry in the "Loving Wives" category, in my humble opinion should finally, sadly, and mercifully end. DQS1 is a very good story teller, but I have a difficult time believing that the story can continue and be very compelling. It seems to me that for the story to go on, DQS1 will be required to reabilitate Debbie's character in some very extreme but unbelieveable fashion.

In this installment, it is pretty clear that the reader is now supposed to start to empathize with Debbie for all of the pain and suffering that she has had over the years starting from grade school forward. Beauty is a bitch sometimes! The reader is going to need to reach a point where Debbie will be forgiven for crapping all over her now ex-husband and her two kids who unfortunately have her as their mother. Just in case DQS1 can convince us that we should care about Debbie that much, then we will most likely have to see her find happiness, hopefully, in only one of her many suitors' arms or she could be redeemed some other way. I don’t know, maybe the honorable thing to do would be for her to get a breast reduction or something. How nice would that be? Debbie's happy! She has seen the error of her ways! Hooray! It's just too bad that she will have put her kids through "hell" in the process and knowingly or unknowingly (who really cares) done everything that she could conjure up to hate, to humiliate and to destroy her ex-husband.

I respect HDK's comments, but he said something that helped convince me that the story has ended as far as I am concerned. It was something to the effect that Debbie will be working in the Public Defender's office and she will be able to continue to make Bill miserable. To take it a step farther, Debbie will not only be able to continue to mess with his personal life, she will be able to make him miserable in his work life as well. Since May 17, 2010, we have been reading about Debbie making Bill’s life miserable. It seems as though by May 17, 2011, we will probably still be reading about Debbie making Bill’s life miserable. I hate to say it, but looking forward to reading chapter after chapter (or piece of chapter after piece of chapter) of Bill being humiliated, tormented and otherwise made miserable by Debbie feels a lot to me like a story meant to appeal to those readers who enjoy cuckoldry. Maybe at one point down the line, DQS1 will have Bill hiding in the closet while he watches Clint Abbot do his ex-wife. Hopefully not, but there can only be so many ways to punish Bill.

So the epilogue for my version of the story that has now ended goes something like this: Bill quickly moves on. He takes another vacation, meets a beautiful woman from Seattle and they fall instantly in love. To be together with his new love, Bill decides to quit his job in the DA’s office and moves to the west coast. BJ and Kelly understand that their Dad is important in their lives and move with him to Seattle. Debbie is devastated and can’t imagine how the kids could choose that loser ex-husband of hers over her. Doug doesn’t get over Debbie’s rebuff and ultimately becomes angry enough to lash out. He has kept his copy of Debbie’s private emails. He makes copies and sends them to Debbie’s parents, her children, B.J. and Kelly, and to any other friends that he knows of Debbie’s. This severs any of Debbie’s old family relationships once and for all. Left alone, she turns to Clint Abbot and she lives happily ever after.

All of that being said, I look forward to the next “new” story that DQS1 offers up. Thanks for sharing! Ohio, USA

I don't have any criticism. I like this story. I don't understand why you continue reading if you don't like it.

Yes, Debbie is human and it appears that there might be a psychosis as the basis for her behavior. I don't believe it will matter to Bill unless he decides to take care of the idiots that raped her. I doubt if he can do so legally.

I don't wish Debbie a bad end. No matter where she lands, she will miss Bill. Even if she ends up with Abbot she will experience occasional pangs of regret

I am looking forward to the resolution of Bill's life. I really wonder where he will end up and who he will be with.

This comment is about writing skill and psychological awareness. DQS1 is no trivial author, whereas some of the commentators, especially Harryin VA, must think a person acts like a robot...if A & B, then C will happen. That kind of writing annoys me because it is trite, trivial and sophomoric. Most of us are not sophomoric. We're adults.

This story is one of the best I've read in about 4 years of visiting this site because the characters are complex and the writing sculpts them as real people whose motives are sometimes not clear...if A&B, then sometimes C, but sometimes D, E, and/or F. My admiration for DQS1's writing ability, to carry flawed individuals through a long series of events, an extended time frame, and through circumstances only DQS1 could invent, is impressive.

Frankly, I don't know where this is going vis a vis Bill & Debbie. Reconciliation or not...only 1 person knows...DQS1. No one else knows.

I could see this story going several ways towards its end, with no one presaged at this time. Enough...I can only say, "Thank you and more please."

Bill in NJ

What a great set-up. Take one saccharine line like this -

We've lived a fairytale and when we're old and wrinkled and the great-grands won't be able to imagine us burning up the sheets, I want them to know we were young and in love once.

- immediately stir in the resurfaced memory of a brutal rape. [Dude, that is some seriously fucked up shit.] Add to this one Killer Granny, one horny Granny I'd Love to Fuck (who knew about GILF's? I guess I don't get out enough) a dash of "young lust in the office" and DAMN! a plot bomb just went off - where's this story going now?

Bill's can't get Aline for more, would like to let the ex just go, wants the kids to know, and isn't at all certain that he has much to show. Doug's gone, Debbie's despondent, the kids are still estranged, the shrink is trying, the author is oh so very quietly sniffing, then there's Sheila, Myra, Heather, Mona, Lew, Norm, Johnny, and all of their issues - phew! - I'm exhausted. What a story.

Well done DQS1.

Oh, and the O'Conner bit at the end was very sweet.

I've got my mess kit ready for another serving.

BTW, if the Bonne Chance is going to another temporary berth in Miami, that is only 345 miles for J-ville. About an hour on commuter flight and about five and a half in an Escalade. Just a thought.

The ill mannered "critics" must have more time on their hands than anyone should if they can take the time to read all your work in such detail, when they dislike it so much.

I check Literotica on a daily basis to see if your latest efforts have been posted. I enjoy the story immensly. Please keep it going.

If you mean that Kelly and BJ are the two persons "he loves most in the world" then it is a partial or full lie, because you have already made it clear that he loves Debbie in a way from which he can NEVER recover!

Daniel,

I have a klaxon alarm set up to alert me whenever a new chapter of this wonderful piece appears on this site!

The odds of you being able to complete this story at this fine level of skill and entertainment are getting smaller and smaller, but I have a feeling that you'll come out just great! Again, great writing!

Regards,

H -

Just a thought, but it would not be wrong from a purely literary standpoint to close it right here. That said, I for one hope there is more.

This is still a very good, very well written story, no doubt. There are lots of interesting twists and turns that keep me reading. But the author has written some other very well written stories that were very good until a fatal flaw came along and ruined them. Case in point: "The Last Goodbye," which was going along great until a "what the fuck?!" ending that most people disliked, judging from the vote scores and comments.

I believe this story also has a fatal flaw, and even though the story is not finished, I worry it's already reached a point where that flaw can't be fixed. And that is the character of Debbie. Simply put, in all the chapters, there is absolutely nothing positive, redeeming, or lovable about her (except her beauty, if that even counts). It seems that in every chapter, she does something or some things to make her even more disliked, and this chapter is no exception. Okay, maybe there's something going on with her relationship with her crazy aunt and/or maybe she has some suppressed rape trauma. So what? There is no sign she was EVER a good person in the first place! None! At best, we get the sense that she was a fair-weathered wife to him for some years, while things were going well. But over and over again, we see that she is supremely selfish and only truly loves herself. If there's some problem, like he gets chubby and loses hair, she's ready to kick him to the curb for someone better. For instance in this chapter, we see that she's fully ready to destroy Bill's career out of spite, and only refrains from doing so because she worries the negative effects would blow back on her. She cries a lot, but ultimately their tears for herself, because things aren't going well for her. I see no sign whatsoever that she has any real love or empathy for Bill, not now, not any time earlier. For instance, if she had any love for him at all, she would have dismissed ruining his career out of at least some concern about what it would do to HIM, not just that it would make her look bad and hurt her career prospects and so forth. But there's no sign of that at all. It's all about her, and it's always all about her.

So I can't see any explanation, be it crazy aunt, rape, UFOs, or anything else, that could turn the story around and make us want to see Bill do anything but run away from her like she's got the plague. Because she has ALWAYS been a selfish bitch who was undeserving to be Bill's wife.

The remedy to this would be to point out at least SOME redeemable virtues in her. Was she ever a good mother? There's no evidence of that, and in fact in this chapter it is strongly suggested the children came out largely okay despite her, not because of her. Was she ever a good wife? We don't see any evidence of that either. In fact, in this chapter we're told she was rubbing up pretty much every big dick she could find just for kicks, even though she knew Bill would see and it would drive him to despair for a long time.

Because Debbie comes across so very badly, it drives a stake through the heart of what would otherwise be a good story. It's not that she was a good person and wife at some point but went bad because of rape or whatever psychological explanation we're going to get - she ALWAYS was a bad person and wife! So finding out about her mental issues is ultimately a moot point, because maybe these problems made her even WORSE, but all signs suggest the marriage was doomed from the very start regardless. And the question of should they or shouldn't they get back together is also largely rendered moot because anyone with half a brain could tell that Debbie is poison and Bill is smart to stay away for her, even if she gets over her issues that are making her irrationally mad at him or whatever. Because ultimately, her beauty and other factors made her far too spoiled and selfish for her to be a good wife to him, from even before their wedding.

This story is good enough to keep reading, but it would have been sooo much better if Debbie was presented with shades of grey, and we actually saw some of the things that made Bill love her (besides her great beauty, or ultimately was that all there was?). The story keeps strongly suggesting that Bill deeply loves her, even now, but it's becoming harder and harder to believe that, because we haven't seen anything whatsoever that's lovable about her. Instead, the author is digging a deeper and deeper hole with each chapter, making her appear more and more detestable. If Debbie is supposed to be the villain, then fine, run with the whole evil Debbie thing. But the problem is it keeps getting suggested in various ways in the story that we're supposed to care for Debbie, when in fact there's nothing there to care for (that we the readers can see, in any case). The growing disconnect between the Debbie that Bill supposedly could love so much and the heartless, selfish Debbie we actually see in chapter after chapter is slowly killing the story. It's getting to the point where not only is she starting to look crazy (as Bill even points out in this chapter), but he looks crazy too for supposedly still loving her (or even for ever loving her in the first place).

I really hope the author can pull a rabbit out of his hat to fix this.

Jerry in Washington State, USA - You continue to make me care about Bill and Debbie and the other characters of their world. I agree Bill needs some anger management counseling. I suspect Bill will learn about Debbie's rape later down the line and take some serious action. Debbie obviously has some emotional /mental issues and I'm interested how she is able to take back her life, if she can. I look forward to whatever romantic or sexual relationships show up for Bill. This is the only story I check daily for a new chapter. I've enjoyed other writers and other stories, but - unfortunately - those writers seem to have given up on their stories. I much look forward to the next chapter - I'll read as long as you want to write.

That father Donleavy was such a wonderful person and at the same time guilty of failing the one that he loved leaves me wondering if maybe something good is hidden in Debbie, she can`t be that self-centered and be good at teaching or research, can she? I know why Bartolo keeps worrying about her position in the university, her musings do not sound like anything either a scholar or a teacher would say. But this is the babe who sank her marraige and perhaps the result of changes in her personality in the last three or four years. This story is well worth thinking about.

I am amazed at your power to weave this story over all this time. It really is the best thing in the genre so far. I loved this chapter also. It answered questions about why Bill and Debbie have done some of the things they've done. And the parts with Bill dealing with the death of the father were moving. Great job.

It would appear as if "shoe-guy Phil" is the poster child for the psychiatric definition of "delusion".

Delusion defined as: A false belief based on incorrect inference about external reality that is firmly sustained despite what almost everyone else believes and despite what constitutes incontrovertible and obvious proof or evidence to the contrary. When a false belief involves a value judgment, it is regarded as a delusion only when the judgment is so extreme as to defy credibility. Delusional conviction occurs on a continuum and can sometimes be inferred from an individual's behavior.

Congratulations shoe guy phil - your irrational drivel demonstrates why the psychiatry profession is alive and thriving.

After reading comments of readers, which, by the way, are unusually thoughtful and respectful for Literotica posters, and rereading parts of chapter one, I realized that Bill is a loose canon! His actions (neglect of family) led to Debbie’s loss of will to fight for her marriage and to her emotional cheating. His unfounded accusations of unfaithfulness, his fight at the award presentation, and his leaving the house were the result of his convicting Debbie without a trial. She was right when she said he was crazy. Only AFTER Bill did these things did Debbie actually cheat physically.

Now read Bill walked out of the courtroom first without looking back THROUGH She thought, "maybe he's right. Maybe I am crazy. I know he makes me crazy”. On Page 2

Then consider Debbie with her counselor on Page 3:

Debbie: "But I could tell that he was hurt. And I've have to be extra special loving to him to make him feel better. And most of the time it was okay. But there were times...there were nights.. I wanted to kick his ass and tell him that I didn't want to be his mother and hold his hand.

"

I wasn't in bed with those guys. I was in bed with him. He won me, not them. I wanted to tell him to be a man and grow some balls and treat me like I belonged to him, not like I was doing him a favor by being with him."

AND the counselor says: "If you were happy with the end of your marriage, if you had accepted it and wanted to create a new life, you would do so. You're still a young woman. And you're stunningly beautiful and you could find another man. 

"But at this point, even though you could, and you say you want to, you haven't. That tells me you're grappling with issues and emotions that you're unwilling to confront."

In the bar, Bill says to Lew’s wife concerning reconciliation: "Not in this lifetime." But then he concludes with “Why bother to try again?” That last doesn’t rule out a desire to reconcile.

My Conclusion: Bill was participating in a self-fulfilling prophecy – He considered himself unworthy of Debbie and he proceeded to make himself so. He expected her to wake up someday and find that she didn’t love him, so he treated her that way, and guess what! It happened!

Meantime, Debbie was listening to an aunt who was grinding her own axe. That grinding left Debbie with no strength to try to change the conditions in her marriage.

They still, I believe, love each other. They’re each so fucked up, though, that neither can punch their way out of the paper bag in which they find themselves.

To the author’s great credit, he has built characters worth analyzing. Witness the thoughtful comments I referenced above. This is truly one of the great efforts on Lit. I hope he can keep it up throughout ‘the rest of the story’.

Regrettably, I have been disappointed on dates but never like this. Fifteen god damn days and this is all you have? I don’t want to hear any shit from all you old farts gumming your food, this is ridiculous. Yes it is good but it is not enough. <P>

I know some of you are going to say hey just wait till it’s finished and then read the whole thing, Naw, that’s not the way it works. The author has a responsibility to the readers. The story must be completed in a timely fashion. Daniel has completely abrogated the right of the reader. He has played all of us for the strokes. Contrary to what y’all think, this is not the greatest story ever written. It only seems so because of the timing. Posted all at once, it would not have generated so many comments. <P>

Unlike the rest of you, I’m going to post some constructive criticism. I’m not going to quote dialogue or paragraphs the author has written. I’m not going to voice my opinion on the direction the story should take. I’m not going to voice an opinion on comments others have made. I am going to be objective. <P>

HDK has referred to the mental illness being a plot device, plain and simple that’s all it is. If you don’t understand the concept, well it is similar to the life threatening event. Put simply a way for authors to wrap up a story. If you didn’t see this one coming, what can I say? I know you hate comparisons to Garyapb but he was wise enough to stay away from psychotherapy. It shows a complete respect for the discipline when a layman thinks he can wrap up a story in short order by using therapy. If I got it right, Teller basically told Debbie, hey you can do better than Bill. Give me a fucking break. <p>

We deserved more.

PK

Another great chapter! Can't wait for chapter 98-Z-99. Love it!

Not really a critic, just know what I like. I don't read anonymous comments, they obviously aren't proud enough to sign them, so I don't read them.

This story along with StatSultan's "Side Bet Bluff" series has me doing a lot of reading lately and loving it. By far the two best stories/novels I have found on this site!

Great story! Very readable! Please keep it coming

Well, I've been following this story and have enjoyed the writing but I just recently read DQS1 other offerings. Wow! The same old crap.

In "The last goodbye" Mona is a total SLUT and all is forgiven. She screwed 30 or 40 guys in nine months and then slept with another guy after reconciliation with Lew....Total SLUT. Kick her to the curb.

So, I can see where this story is going. Debbi, total SLUT and all will be forgiven. Screw this I'm out of here.

There is no way I could possibly stand going through another DQS1 story where in his world view being a SLUT is perfectly all right and everyone should just accept it, take them back into their arms and life and live happily ever after.

For gosh sake DQS1 get real if you're a man ( and I'm betting you're a woman) and your wife did what Debbi and Mona did, would you, could you take them back? Not in my world.

I said it before. You write YOUR story and I'll read it. Less comments from the peanut gallery now on the negative side. You think they like it more now perhaps? I find myself reading the comments even more to see if I missed something. I haven't ... I hope

But, Debbie, was attacked/raped/soiled WHILE they were going through the divorce, right? or was it during marriage? If during divorce She (no woman does) deserves that and she had to go through it alone now....right? And.... who was it that sent her to work for the public defender AND WHY?? What good can that do? Just guessing...

Thanks for the tremendous effort/work and thanks for sharing-honoring us on Lit. Great story DQS. Write on, I'll read.

x

I'm not going to analyze this. All I have to say is keep it coming. If you could do it more often it would be greatly appreciated however I understand that some people have a life.

DQS, I really enjoyed this chapter and all the emotion you packed in. Damn, I wish I hadn't read this and simply waited for several chapters to post. This is a great story!

You even dangle another dream too dissect and interpret! You are a wonderful story teller and I look forward to the next chapter!

Thanks for the great chapter, the whole story has a way of making the reader feel as if they are looking over Bill's shoulder and watching his life being played out.

Well done

You have got to be kidding me, right?

"His actions (neglect of family) led to Debbie’s loss of will to fight for her marriage and to her emotional cheating."

In one of the first few chapters Debbie herself revealed that she has always flirted with and let herself be groped by other men, before and during their marriage. Bill knew about that, despite her trying to hide it. That is HER neglect of her marriage and her family. Right from the start! Bill, seeing that, and knowing her history, slowly starts to realize that he cannot stop her from flirting with other men, and starts to retreat from his marriage. BECAUSE OF DEBBIE'S ACTIONS.

Debbie's flirting caused Bill's loss of will to fight for his marriage. Debbie sees THAT as an excuse to start an emotional affair with a more handsome, younger man. Unfounded accusations of unfaithfulness? Since when is an emotional affair NOT being unfaithful? As long as you don't have sex, it's not cheating?

His fight at the award ceremony? Debbie hides the fact from Bill that she is going to the award ceremony with her lover (yes, lover, given their cybersex emails), dances far too closely with Doug, gives Doug a LOVER'S KISS right in front of a huge audience, and when Bill interrupts, she chooses Doug over her own husband? Go read chapter 1, if you've forgotten how Debbie acted.

Belknap, if your wife gives her lover a French kiss, you don't get angry? You like being cuckolded? Do you have an open marriage?

As for Bill leaving the house, in chapter 1 Debbie tells Bill she is going to get a restraining order against him, because he is, in her words, "dangerous man prone to violence". Because he tried to punch his wife's lover!

Bill didn't leave the house, he was FORCED to leave, by his ever so loving wife.

"My Conclusion: Bill was participating in a self-fulfilling prophecy – He considered himself unworthy of Debbie and he proceeded to make himself so. He expected her to wake up someday and find that she didn’t love him, so he treated her that way, and guess what! It happened!"

True, Bill thought he was unworthy of Debbie. The other side of the coin is that Debbie herself also thought Bill was unworthy of her. By her own admission in the earlier chapters, she's always let men grope her. Her excuse is that if she didn't, she might piss off some nephew or cousin of someone important who could make Bill's life miserable. Hah, sure. Later it's revealed that Debbie, by her own admission, simply likes all the attention, and being groped. That it is an entirely natural state of affairs. If men don't lust after her, there's something wrong with them.

Why did Debbie never realize that it was hurting Bill? Why did she never thought of that? If she truly loved Bill, why didn't she stop the men from groping her? No guy wants to be accused of sexual harassment, especially important people. Debbie simply thought Bill wasn't worthy enough to fully devote herself to. And Bill KNEW.

I am starting to agree with one Anon above, that there is NOTHING positive about Debbie. Virtually every chapter Debbie does something that makes people dislike her more. Everything is and has always been about her. Even her tears, her crying, her mourning is for her loss of cozy lifestyle, or loss of lovers. Not once does she think of others, places someone else first. She has no empathy for others at all.

The rape? that only excuses her vicious verbal attacks on Bill's work, NOT her flirting with other men, that had started from even BEFORE their marriage. She was a college slut, remember?

Her aunt Clarice? Did she listen to Clarice that much? That it completely affected her thinking? Does Debbie have no free will? No thought of the consequences of her own actions? It seems like everything she does can be chalked up to her childhood or the rape. Shitty childhood, shitty personality, can't change that, it's pre-ordained. If that is so, she'll never change into a remotely good person.

This chapter is superb. It only reinforces my belief that Bill and Debbie still belong together but are too stubborn to admit it to each other. It is quite apparent that they both love each other. But, will they both wake up and see it or will they both let it die. This story deserves an ending where they get back together and resolve things for theur own sake as well as for the kids sake. Call ne sentimental. At least we now know that psycological problems plague them both shown by their anger and thinking. Keep up the good writting. I hope to see many more chapters in this story/

From Debbie's dream, described in this chapter, we are left with the question of whether it was solely a dream and not reality OR it was only a bad dream. I wonder if it is possible for psychiatrists to induce a state whereby the patient is awake and can remember "hidden" thoughts and describe events they'd experienced (with Debbie her "possible" rape and torture). If that can be achieved and it was a real occurrence then those 4 guys should be brought to justice and made to pay for their crime.

Just to say that I am still reading and loving it. Pray continue for ever.

What would you charge the men with? Failure to pay a just debt? If Debbie was in here normal MO, then it would have been difficult to rape the willing.

No, I'm not kidding you. We're reading the same things, but our take is certainly different. You are working from a very different set of beliefs (?), experiences (?) than am I. Thanks for listening.

You string along your audience quite skillfully. Readers comments seem like overhearing some chicks analizing 'Hysteria Lane'. Will this story last as long? You author are, like you portrayed your Debbie, an attention whore. 'Nuff said. Lol again.

I am trying to see your POV here, but for the life of me, it just doesn't seem to make any sense. It seems to boil down to "who did what first, to destroy the marriage".

You say Debbie retreated from the marriage because Bill was always caught with work. I say Bill retreated from the marriage (by way of his work), because Debbie never stopped flirting. Who's right? Who (Debbie or Bill) didn't care about the marriage anymore, first?

You mention beliefs and experiences. Those are subjective. Earlier you said that Bill left the house, not giving Debbie a chance to explain and immediately condemned her.

I countered with the FACT that Debbie forced Bill to leave by way of a restraining order.

"Don't come back to the house tonight, or any night, Bill. I'm going to get a protective order keeping you away from me and the kids. You've shown that you're a dangerous man prone to violence and I question your mental stability."

That is from Chapter 1. Bill didn't leave, he was forced. So much for convicting Debbie without a trial...

Can that statement by Debbie be taken any other way? Is it subjective? That she does want Bill to come home, but he refused because he doesn't want to listen? I do not see it.

I do have a question about the award ceremony that I would like you to answer.

Hypothetical situation. If your wife had a lover, and she was going to meet him, and you KNOW she is going to meet him, would you follow her and then confront them? Or would you sit at home and do nothing? (Assuming that you don't have an open marriage, and assuming you don't want your wife to have a lover that she prefers over you.)

If you WOULD go and confront them, why? Why cause such ruckus and destroy her reputation as a faithful wife, and expose her as a cheater? Even if it is the truth?

Because THAT is what Bill did. Expose Debbie as a cheater. And you blame Bill? Don't shoot the messenger, you know? Debbie is the cheater, Bill only let people know.

I am amazed by some readers, that they think Bill should not have gone to the award ceremony and have "caused such trouble" for Debbie.

If the rape/torture dream scene did really happen and it occurred when Debbie was either in College or Bill's wife; and Debbie was able to identify the men, Bill would be informed of the crime. He might have the men closely watched to determine if they were still doing the same sort of thing to women. He would have to consider prosecuting them based on available evidence. If he need to, as an alternative, he could even turn to friends of his in low places (see one of the previous chapters). Also, Bill can be a mean guy in the Jacksonville courthouse and those monsters were very brutal in their attack on the women in the restroom (probably Debbie in the dream; maybe in reality).

I know the identity of belknap023, and it should quite evident to you also.

I have disagreed with some of your comments in the past, and was going to write a response to belknap to pretty well match your own, then read "we are observing from different experiences" and came to the conclusion: IT ALL DEPENDS ON WHAT THE (DEFENITION) MEANING OF THE WORD "IS, IS"

LOL.

In the words of the immortal Stan Lee, NUFF SAID.

LOL, HAA HAA HAA HAA.

Tom

Others are in the process of trying to dissect your episodes in infinitesimal detail. Not for me. I am enjoying the series and look forward to wherever it goes. Who knows, maybe our two protagonists will emerge as functioning adults...

HardDayKnight has a story "Eleanor Rigby." It begins with the husband feeling he was not good enough for her, but by the end of the story found out she was not good enough for him. This story is exactly the same. Until Bill realizes this little fact, he will never heal as he should. The facts are, he was always too good for her. Debbie never deserved a person like Bill. Even Doug said Bill was a good guy. So far I have not seen one redeeming quality in Debbie. Pride goes before destruction and a haughty spirit before a fall.

Sometimes late at night

I lie awake and watch her sleeping

She's lost in peaceful dreams

So I turn out the lights and lay there in the dark

And the thought crosses my mind

If I never wake up in the morning

Would she ever doubt the way I feel

About her in my heart

If tomorrow never comes

Will she know how much I loved her

Did I try in every way to show her every day

That she's my only one

And if my time on earth were through

And she must face this world without me

Is the love I gave her in the past

Gonna be enough to last

If tomorrow never comes

'Cause I've lost loved ones in my life

Who never knew how much I loved them

Now I live with the regret

That my true feelings for them never were revealed

So I made a promise to myself

To say each day how much she means to me

And avoid that circumstance

Where there's no second chance to tell her how I feel

So tell that someone that you love

Just what you're thinking of

If tomorrow never comes

This is my second or third comments on this story. Please let me start by saying "please leave the author alone". We are here to read a story and not telling the aurhor how to develop a story. It is the author's right and privilege to tell his tale the way he wants. The story's conclusion and/or the way it develops might not be everybody's liking (simply could not satisfy everyone), but it is the author to decide on how it goes. This story has a lot of similarity to other stories here and that is why this category is call "Loving Wives" (what do u expect). This story has its ups and downs because it is a very long story (the authors made it clear at the very beginning). But we have to admit, it is a great story. The reason we have so many arguement on the characters here because they are so real and readers are start to forget this is only a STORY (credit to DQS1and you should find the ultimate satisfaction as any writer could dream of).

Now it is back to this installment. I love this and DQS1 is doing a great job AGAIN. The characters are coming together and I think we are at least 1/2 way or more into the story (good is that I might end my addiction soon and the bad is there will be no reason for me to live, just kidding). I could not wait for another installment on WWWM. DQS1, please hurry but do not comprise your talented writing just to keep us happy (we could wait if we have to).

Final point. There are so many talented writer here. I have quite a few favorites (HARDDAYKNIGHT, LONGHORN_07, JOSEPHUS, OHIO to name a few. I also want to mention author DG HEAR. Your story "ZOEA - MY WIFE" is my first read on cheating wives and get me hook to this kind of story. Thanks a lot and I hate you... just kidding and I really enjoy it). For all my favorite authors in this category, please continue to submit your story. I am so addicted, I need more of these stories and you are all good. OMG, I need help.

DQS1 has painted himself into a corner and while we wait for the paint to dry we hear about old men with sick wives and eager mistresses, Irish priests and their misguided families, Paris investigators, African terrorists, French cruise directors, boxing coaches, nearly blind lawyers, horny secretaries, cuckolded University officials, successful authors, threatening perps, career criminals with soft hearts, and God only knows what will be next. All entertaining, but the problem is that the paint won’t dry because it was painted, not with a brush, but with a word-processor. DQS1 wants Bill and Debbie to get back together but he has created their characters in a manner incompatible with his goal. Debbie is an amoral whore who temporarily controlled her passions (while raising her kids) until a handsome young professor returned her to her natural habitat, whoredom; and Bill is an upright moralist (perhaps I should say uptight) as zealous in his assault on immorality as Debbie is in embracing it. They are a square peg and a round hole, and no matter how much Debbie stretches that hole, I doubt that the square peg will fit. My previous idea of statutory rape (allowing Bill to be a hero and Debbie a genuinely regretful wife) was ruled out by a technicality – you gotta be 18 to fuck on Literotica and if you’re 18 it ain’t statutory rape in Florida. As an author myself, I am wondering how I would solve this rubic’s cube DQS1 has created, and divine intervention is the only idea that comes to mind, short of Bill falling off of his pedestal (and that would be intervention by the dark angel).

FOLKS Belknap is our old friend and leader of the "woman all good men all bad " crowd ....size14shoe.

PROOF?

Belknap's opening paragraph is identical to size14show dumb fuck assertion he made back in the opening 2 chapters that Debbie had

1 done nothing wrong

2 had Not cheated...

3 Bill was a "loose cannon" and a Drama queen.

One could make the case that Bill in the beginning of the story COULD be called too moral and too uptight. But to assert that Bill was a loose cannon and drama queen while he is putting oganized crime lords in jail is fucking Nuts.

The thing is is even in the subsequent chapters where Debbie & bill do meet and she is confronted by her emails Debbie finally ADMITS she was cheating emotionally and did have every intention to fuck Doug very soon.

Of course size14shoe STILL argued that Debbie admission which totally undercut his defense of Debbie ....proved nothing. You see when you are delusional crackpot like size14shoe facts mean little.

in the 1st four parts of this story size 14shoE asserted Bill's accusation of unfaithfulness was unfounded. Now we have belknap making the EXACT same idiot claim.

And in the 1st few chapters size14shoe also argeud Bill Voluntarily lef the house... even though size14shoe knows that Debbie filed a restraining order against Bill entering the House.

and now again we have Belknap making the same bullshit argument.

It does matter how many times anyone cites the actual story passage where she TELLS Bill he cannot come home and that he is legally barred from entering the home.

Belknap/szie14show will never admit it.

May I suggest that you are taking this story and the comments about it FAR too seriously. You need to do something and stop obsessing about a story

I can't find any redeeming quality in Debbie. She has been sexually active since age twelve, and has, basically, been a product of her own hedonistic nature ever since. I can't see where she ever really gave a "flying fuck" about Bill. He was always too good for her slutty ass. I sure hope you let him get own with life and with someone, who is able to reciprocate the goodness and loving kindness that he is capable of. It is a fascinating story.

Harry has recognized me! And the fact that he disagrees with me indicates that I might be right! Thanks, Harry.

Very good, very few errors, just the right length. My only complaint about the plot is the slamming of his wife up against the wall in the lobby of the divorce court -- for a smart man, Mr. Maitland sure can be dumb sometimes. Had it not been for Lew, the judge would have put him into a cell with Bubba for several days -- she obviously dislikes the male gender. Thanks for writing.

PK, your comments are so refreshing. Honest criticism but not spiteful, well maybe that part about us gumming our food was a little over the line. I have to ask. The tone was very similar to "Wake Up Call" last chapter, was that you too? <P>

I was worried the author was going to drag Debbie down even further. Thank God, she is finally showing some self respect. If reconciliation is to indeed happen the author has to give her some redeeming qualities. This is not to say Bill is without fault, far from it. Time for both of them to wake the fuck up.

DQS1 is really pulling out all the stops trying to get some sympathy for Debbie. In this chapter Debbie has nightmares of being mouth raped/golden showered in a public men’s restroom by three men (no doubt al-Qaida drug dealers on their way to blow up a widow and blind children’s orphanage.)

Rape is terrible thing and No means NO-however I am awaiting to see how DQS1 has Debbie ending up on her knees in a Public Men’s restroom. Will DQS1 have Debbie being waylaid on her way to church Bingo after her shift taking care of crippled kittens-or did Debbie pick the wrong guys to play with that time? Until her playmates got rough Debbie slipped into slut mode quickly.

It is still going to be a long shot getting any sympathy for Debbie –short of a flesh eating bacteria that ravages her looks and body-not a lot of love for DEbbie here.

It seems this rape of Debbie took place in the recent past-as DQS1 has Debbie comment ”... Just as she should have told Bill. He would have killed them. Even with their marriage in tatters, he would have hunted them down..” Debbie’s and Bill marriage was not in tatters until shortly before Doug came on the scene.

DQS1 please do not allow Doug to ride into the sunset (new job and all) with just the “dusting” Bill gave him. As written now Doug is the only winner in the story so far-trading a minor fight for 3 months of MILF sex + all the chaos he helped create.

Thanks DQS1 –I enjoy the read & even most of the comments!

oldwayne says, "I can't find any redeeming quality in Debbie. She has been sexually active since age twelve, and has, basically, been a product of her own hedonistic nature ever since."

`

An 18 yo fucking a 12 yo girl is statuatory rape. Being raped by an 18 year old at age 12 may be considered "sexually active" by a pedophile, but to characterize someone fucked by 20 adults including friends of her father before she was 15, as having a hedonistic nature is over the top.

`

Why are you reading WWWM? Shouldn't you be jerking off to some 'hedonistic' child pornography? oldwayne, you are one sick fuck.

`

It doesn't take a child psychologist to see that Debbie's life experiences would give her "different" views of sex than a "normal" childhood would give. Her mindset, when she was raped in college -- the time Bill rescued her -- was a tip off that all was not OK with Debbie. Not that she was mentally ill, but had experiences that gave her a distorted view of sex.) She in some ways "liked" being gang-banged. Not only would she wrongly think the rapes were her fault, she would mentally adapt to them by "liking" them.

`

No, I don't think Debbie is a common slut with no morales and who only thinks of fucking every male with a big dick.

Since reading that scene, dream or real, I have been haunted by what happened to Debbie in that filthy toilet by men who should spend about 10 years being Bubba's bitch.

`

Why didn't she tell Bill or anyone for that matter? Given her experience of being fucked by adults 20 or so times between 12 and 15, I expect that in her mind she thought that it was her fault. Why not? A few commenting here thought she was at fault.

`

So some assholes decided that if she wasn't going to fuck them voluntarily, they would "take it." They wouldn't fuck her pussy, they had the same thoughts that the Debbie hater's here had, she was fucking lot's of men. If she was an easy fuck, why take a chance on raping her?

`

I hope all this is going to come out in her sessions with Tedder and through Tedder, Bill is going to find out about this rape. He may want to not reconcile, but I sure hope he makes those assholes pay.

`

I said early on that I thought Debbie was a victim, not a perpetrator. I may be wrong -- Harry has "proven" it -- but I still think Debbie is a good person. I think she has strength of character, because IMO it took real character not to fuck Doug -- or any number of men -- long before Bill created the scene at the Awards Banquet. Her casual or insensitivity to men hitting on her, is rooted in her childhood of sexual abuse.

`

I do believe Bill was justified in being angry, etc., but not starting a fist-fight with Doug. I could have had more respect for him if he had done something to stop their antics instead of standing around like a cuckhold wimp watching it happen.

I still find it very strange/curious/unusual that readers like size14 and belknap think that Bill "created the scene" at the awards ceremony. I just cannot get my head wrapped around that.

Why did Bill "create a scene"? Because he saw Debbie kiss Doug on the podium, in front of an audience, like lovers would. If Debbie had not cheated on Bill, Bill would have had no reason to "create a scene".

Here's a reverse gender situation. A married man is out on a date with his lover, sitting in a cozy restaurant, being loveydovey. Then his wife comes in, screams at the woman "You slut!", at her two-timing husband "You cheating bastard!" and throws water in their faces.

Who created the mess in the restaurant? The wife, for confronting the lovers? Or the cheating husband, for being there with his lover in the first place? By your logic, the wife is at fault for creating a scene in the restaurant.

"I do believe Bill was justified in being angry, etc., but not starting a fist-fight with Doug. I could have had more respect for him if he had done something to stop their antics instead of standing around like a cuckhold wimp watching it happen."

Wait. You think Bill should NOT have "created a scene", AKA the fight-fight with Doug. But at the same you wanted him to do something instead of standing around like a cuckold (it's not cuckHold) wimp watching it happen? You wanted him to do something, but at the same time NOT do something? You mean he stood around like a cuckold wimp by starting a fistfight? And what did he watch happen? Dancing with Doug? That's innocent. The kiss? That's when he did something. So what DID he watch happen like a cuckold wimp?

He stopped their antics by the fistfight, AFTER he saw the kiss. Do you mean he should've stopped her from going in the first place? Or stopped her from dancing with Doug, before the kiss?

Remember, even after the lover's kiss Debbie insisted they were just friends. If Bill had stopped her from going, Debbie would've gotten very angry at him not letting her go to "an important school function", or if it had been just dancing, Debbie could've just said "you're overreacting, there's nothing going on", and Bill would have nothing to stand on.

I'm very interested in when size14 thinks Bill should've stopped Debbie.

Please don't try to put words in my mouth. I didn't say Bill was at fault for creating a scene, I said he created a scene. Starting a fist fight is creating a scene. Doug kissing Debbie and her returning the kiss is inappropriate behavior and is attributable to why Bill lost his cool and started the fight. Your example of a wife throwing a glass of water in her husband and his mistress's face and screaming, "You slut!" in a restaurant is creating a scene. A husband being romantic with his mistress in that restaurant is inappropriate behavior. There is a difference between making/creating a scene and inappropriate behavior that has someone feel the need to create a scene. As I explain this to you Mousse9, I have to wonder, how old are you? Here's a way you might be able to understand the concept: If I fart in church, it's not my wife's fault because she served beans for supper the night before.

`

With a little thought you might have worked out for yourself how Bill could have prevented the inappropriate behavior. Bill could have walked up to his wife as soon as he arrived and said something like, "Hi, Debbie, Doug. I decided to come to this event. I haven't been going out with my wife much lately and I wanted to be with her tonight." This stops the childish fighting and has him be something besides a wimp watching his wife and her suiter.

`

Standing in the shadows waiting for something to happen is very popular on LW. I realize that is necessary in creating tension and is used to make the stories lines work. In real life that way is a sign of immaturity.

`

The macho fist fighting that you favor over the confronting the situation before it escalates, is one way of dealing with it. I find it to be a bit "Harry High School" and not suited to someone of Bill's social and professional status. This kind of activity is what I was referring to as a "loose cannon" -- flying off the handle and jeopardizing his career.

`

I have referred to Bill as a Drama Queen also. The fight in front of 1000 or so academics at an awards dinner and his leaving his wedding ring and some blood on the note he left for Debbie to find is an example of what I mean by drama queen. Striding into work and taking over the closing arguments in a case another DA was handling is also in the realm of drama queen IMO.

`

I think that Debbie has had her head seriously fucked up with regard to what is acceptable and what is not -- meaning that being felt up is no big deal to her but she knows to and how to defuse inappropriate touching. Her concepts of self-worth and what has her be an OK person has been damaged by the brutalization of her early teens. And I don't consider this mental illness, just screwed up thinking. Most rape victims need counseling or therapy and they are not mentally ill. Debbie for sure qualifies to be a rape victim.

I liked the way bill reacted in courthouse, any man can burst out when pushed, may he will feel sorry about it later, and he shoud, but you shoud let others what you feel, before it he ounds to me very unreal, bottling up everyhthing, i could not imagine a man could be like him, having no anger, after all that happpened and listen to bitch everytime she bitch about evrything, and i hate threapy like she is having, they justify everything, even child rape can rationalized by them, saying they are mentally sick, sickness? every badthing we do is because of sickness, stealing, killing, rape, any crime. everyone is sick if they do so, greed is sickness, everyone has reason for doing bad things, some for greed, some for satisfaction, some for pleasure, some for excitement, some for revenge but all have reasons, you can raionalise noy justify but do they need to be forgiven because they had reason, punishment could be different, there must be one, otherwise others will repeat and they will be able to justfiy not only rationalize. She did wrong, whatever the reason was, and because of something, Bill did in past we dont know yet, it will make it suspense story not characteristic story, like you did in Last good bye, wife tells in the end what was the reason for cheating, and it was totally out of character as for as readers were knew husband, i means using things like that you can change your story anytime you want, you can stretch this story to hundered chapters and in the last paragraph say that she did it because she was raped once, and she blamed Bill for that because she wanted him to stay home, that night but he was not with her, and he was supposed to assume she could be raped in their own home, or he once refused to have sex with her, or sub-conciuoslt he had beaten her once, you pulll that crap any time, someting we did not know but tit would be suspense, surely it is not loving wife stiry, because i dont see any wife here who is doing what a wife is supposed to do, hell idont see even a descent woman, may Debbie's mother, but every mother will give sound advice to her daughter, even slut like Debbie was able to lecture her on right and wrong. I am asuuming evry lady in you story is slut, and then it will be good to read your stories, with that type of environment variables, I will assume husband married a whore/prostitue then it becomes very logical, then I can ratinalise evry thing, and Bill and Debbie, seems, both responsible for marriage failure, and Dauge just seem to be victim in their mess.

Its better in man dominating society, when woman given equal rights in everything, because of their weakness, and sympathy from others, and respect(like a gentelman supposed to give them) they always got upperhand, and it becomes woman dominating. like here we have, evry woman slut, evry man wimp. they will fight for their women, even after they are married, what is this a jungle or cave man story. real life is much complicated than just sex. But by setting mind with some necessary assumptions, it seems good story, I have set frame of mind needed for this story to digest, so just keep writing, i will keep reading.

This should have been the end of this story. The writer threw a new bone towards readers to keep their interest. Debbie's brutal rape, dream, nightmare, mental problem etc. This is just beating around the bush, its like going round and round and never coming to the center point. They both are divorced, fine, move on, use your time, effort, enegry, and tallent along with your characters for new stories.

Time for something new, ENOUGH of Debbie the slut, whore wife, and Bill the DA, miserable husband and father.

A previous comment highlighted the fact that the idiot size 14/belknap is completely delusional [as pointed out in that definition]. It is really difficult to comprehend anyone [fag or otherwise] can be that completely ignorant yet arrogant at the same time. No doubt, size 14 fails impress anyone and must be trying to get DQS's attention so he develops a character in this story for that pathetic fuck.

Simply by saying that Bill created a scene, without further information, implies that he is at fault. That is what I was referring to.

Arriving at the award ceremony, and thereby preventing Debbie and Doug from inappropriate behavior would only be postponing the inevitable. It would not have stopped her from her affair with Doug since that was already ongoing, it would only be a missed opportunity for the lovers. Given the fact that Debbie did not wanted Bill to be there, and has in fact lied to him about it being a boring meeting to make him not want to go, what would Debbie say when they got home AFTER the ceremony, if Bill had gone?

Let's say Bill HAD gone to the award ceremony, and thereby thwarted the lovers from being loveydovey at the party. From reading their emails, he'd know exactly when and where the lovers would meet. Does that mean he has to make an excuse to go with her everytime, so she wouldn't meet Doug? Be her chaperone to prevent her physical cheating? What kind of life would that be?

Given the story, and the facts presented in chapter 1,let's take it further, a "what if". Debbie had wanted to divorce Bill sometime soon after the ceremony. Bill goes to the award ceremony, prevents the lovers from inappropriate behavior, sometime soon after the ceremony Debbie hits Bill with divorce, and starts fucking Doug.

Bill accuses Debbie of having an affair with Doug, but he has no freaking leg to stand on, nobody will believe him (especially if the emails are not divulged), he's written off as being a hateful ex, and Debbie and Doug will have gotten away with fooling Bill for so long. Instead of exposing Debbie as a cheater and Bill as the wronged husband, it will be Debbie who has found happiness (in Doug's arms), and Bill as the ex who can't take it that she divorced him, spouting nasty accusations.

"Standing in the shadows waiting for something to happen is very popular on LW. I realize that is necessary in creating tension and is used to make the stories lines work. In real life that way is a sign of immaturity."

Wanting to know, seeing for yourself, and confirming with your own eyes, whether your spouse is actually cheating on you, is immaturity? Wouldn't it be MORE immature to just divorce her based on unverified rumors? (Like apparently many wife characters do to their husbands in Loving Wives stories.)

What is better, being proactive, or reactive?

This is a popular dilemma in Loving Wives. Preventing her from seeing her lover, not knowing for sure she'll stop, and risking that she'll find a way at a later date, or actually seeing her cheat or not, and knowing it for a fact either way?

For some reason this reminds me of undercover cops waiting in the shadows watching a drugdeal happening. Are the cops being immature for watching and waiting until the drugdeal actually happens, before arresting? Why not nip it in the bud, tell the dealers to scram and prevent the deal from happening? Which is better?

Carlos, <P>

No, I didn’t write Wake Up Call. I can understand why you think I did. I thought somebody had been reading my mail when I saw it. I wasn’t going to post a comment until the story was over. However, I wanted the author of the comment to know he wasn’t the only one swimming against the current. <P>

Sorry, about the gumming your food remark, it was a low blow. I just wanted to get everyone’s attention. Although I have noticed the average age of the male readership on Literotica seems to be in the sixties. While the average age of the female readership seems to be in the twenties. I’m sure there is some deep psychological reason for this disparity. <P>

I see where I made an error on my previous posting. It should have been disrespect not respect. <P>

Thank you for the nice words, kind sir. <P>

PK

but is it likely that (if there was a rape) it was done as revenge on Bill? That would explain how she might blame him. Was she trying to protect him by being quiet?

Because it cycles around through so many issues that are not part of a coherent central story. This is a fantastic soap. Not good or bad. Just what it is. Hard hitting ending? Or a wimper?

TO ALL, PLEASE FORGIVE MY FRENCH IN THIS POST AS I AN GOING TO CUSS LILE A SAILOR, WHICH I WAS IN NAM. as p personal note, met a brother in arms who was there with my, but not together. A TRUE HERONOT A STORY.

NOW:

Color me Harry high school, a loose cannon, a "wimp" (for standing around and gathering proof of what was happening), or any other label you like.

Bill was correct in waiting to see what was happening between his "WIFE" and her latest squeeze, Dougie, before the confrontation, and FUCK the career. There are more important things in a "MAN'S" lift than a job, such as his family which Bill worked very hard to provide a decent safe life and living for, even though Debbie doesn't think so.

Some say Bill was wrong to fight for his wife even though Debbie says he won her the first time by almost getting killed defending her, but this time Bill actually won the fight but Debbie chose the pathetic loser Dougie, (NICE MOVE, I HAVE NEVER BEEN A WOMAN BUT I THINK IF MY "YOUNG WELL HUNG STUD" COULDN'T WHIP AN OLD FAT OUT OF SHAPE BALD GUY, I DONT THINK I WOULD HAVE THE BALLS, AND WOULD BE TOO EMBARRESED TO LEAVE WITH HIM, MUCH LESS LET HIM HAVE HIS WAY WITH ME), instead, and proceeded to fuck his lights out that night and then the next day takes the kids and runs home to mommy instead of going home.

Sunday evening she shows up at home and expect everything to proceed somewhat normally.

Monday morning Bill leaves for "WORK", and while he is there Debbie goes behind his back again, and gets (probably at the urging of her fuck buddy) a restraining order and kicks Bill out without even letting him get a change of under ware, (NICE FUCKING SLUTTY MOVE THERE BITCH) so she can move her "FUCK BUDDY" INTO BILLS BED, EVEN THOUGH HER CHILDREN ARE IN THE HOUSE".

Dougie lost two fights and if he stays around he will lose others as he has no depth. He is not one to ride the river with. "REMEMBER, HE LOST HIS CHANCE TO GO TO THE OLYMPICS TO AN AMATURE".

Now like I say, "COLOR ME HARRY HIGH SCHOOL, A LOOSE CANON, OR WHATEVER ELSE YOU CHGOOSE TO, but like Bill if you fuck with my family, even though they may choose to leave me or not even care about me, as a man I will tear your fucking head off and shit down your wind pipe until you choke to death then piss on your grave, AND THE ONLY WAY YOU WILL STOP ME IS TO KILL ME OR COMPLETLY DISABLE ME, AS THE FIRST FIGHT IS ONLY ROUND ONE. Then fuck the Job, career and/or statue in the community be damned AS I WILL HAVE MY DIGNITY AND WILL BE ABLE TO STAND TALL AMONGST OTHER MEN.

Too many so called men (wimps) these days depend on others such as physicists, and or physiologists to tell them what is right and wrong and how they should act in a "CIVILIZED" society.

In that group I also include lawyers, and professors who only spout theory and have no real life experiences outside the institutions of higher learning (HAA HAA HAA) "lower education".

So I say, GET THE FUCK OFF BILLS BACK AND PUT THE BLAME WHERE IT BELONGS, THATS ON DEBBIE AND THE PATHETIC WIMP DOUGIE.

Totally agree with so much of what you say. I put on a clean pair of pants, and an ironed shirt.

Wake up call, deckview...... so many saying the same thing. This author has real talent. More than most on this site. Character interaction, character depth. At this point though, with all the great subplots,.........and the thousands and thousands of words written and read, is it ever going to be time to move past,.....Debbie does something bad, Bill gets pissed and walks away fuming.

They are finally divorced. Thank god! Except for this one thing, a person could go to the concession, get snacks and drinks for the whole family, take it back in the theatre, go back out to car in the parking lot, change the bald tire, come back in... wash hands in the restroom, go back in the theatre and find out from the wife they haven't REALLY talked, argued, or fought anything out yet!!! Nope.... all this time and we still haven't got any more directin than Debbie did something awful and Bill is mad. I wanted more too.

Author you have talent. Most don't. I sure don't. Don't waste your story while showing us your abilities with only the fluff.

Dan

I Agree with so much of what you say. Seems some think I have stood up for Debbie........Nope, not really. Couldn't care less who started this family crisis.

Sticking up for family. I loved how he stood up for Kelly instantly upon finding out. Great parent. I just wish Bill would be a great spouse and stick up for himself "WITH!!!" Debbie and have it out there too, but I guess that ends the story and everyones guessing as to this families problems.

Hope my writing "at you" doesn't cause you any grief from the "vicious little group" in here. Thank you for your service. Glad to be able to thank you. Been to way too many funerals these past few yrs.

Trained: Orlando, Michigan. Served seven yrs. without the honor of a military branch uniform, although extremely proud of my accomplishments. Worked with, and through all branches except the Coast Guard. 8 person unit. Greatest people on this planet!! Lost 5 in one shitmess hellhole. Remaining 3 of us were given options. I chose training. Hopefully I put 32 more able men/women in place for all of us...... to sit and do this w/ our free time.

TigerDan

Debbie's early promiscuity, sexually active and indiscriminate in her partners before age 15, fits the pattern of having been sexually abused by an adult she knew and trusted, perhaps a father, or an uncle. Someone she loved.

Developing breasts does not make a girl sexually wanton. Precocious development actually makes girls less accepting of their body and developing feelings. By the time she had breasts, her personal boundaries had already been demolished, she had already been sexualized at probably a very young age.

Debbie's relationship with her mother seems to be civil, yet with a distinct distance. Is the distance a part of Debbie's way of protecting her mother from the truth? While at the same time blaming her mother for not recognizing the truth and protecting her daughter.

I think maybe the gang rape happened when she was in her young teens. That age is very malleable and repressing traumatic memory is actually very hard to do as an adult, ask any Vet. If she repressed the event, she would still have the traumatic aftershocks. She just wouldn't know what is causing the intense fear and panic. Being held would be comforting. So she seeks sex partners for comfort, for protection from the panic.

If my rambling thoughts are true about Debbie, she's going to crash and burn very soon. Possibly even have a psychotic break and a suicide attempt. She'll go through a long period of being extraordinarily fragile before she begins to heal.

But, I've been wrong before and these are just fun guesses.

I'd agree with you, but it's not. You say, "Monday morning Bill leaves for "WORK", and while he is there Debbie goes behind his back again, and gets (probably at the urging of her fuck buddy) a restraining order and kicks Bill out without even letting him get a change of under ware, (NICE FUCKING SLUTTY MOVE THERE BITCH)"

`

Bill packed 2 suit cases and left the previous weekend, saying to himself, "I really didn't think I'd be coming back."

`

Here's the whole passage detailing how much underware he packed among other things:

`

"When I did start moving, I amazed myself. I found myself going up to our bedroom, pulling two suitcases out of a closet and then systematically putting in enough pants, shirts, shoes, coats, and miscellaneous clothing items to go a couple of weeks without having to wear the same items twice.

`

I filled the back of the Escalade and then went back in and got miscellaneous court files and computer discs.

`

I grabbed a piece of blank copy paper out of the copier attached to the main desktop and scrawled a few words on it. Then I put my ring, and some of my blood, on it and closed the lights of our bedroom.

`

I locked the house behind me. I'd turned off all the lights and only a dark hulk of a building remained. I had lived there for almost 10 years with my wife and children and I really didn't think I'd be coming back.

According to GG the rape in the mens room likely occurred BEFORE Bill and Debbie married not during their marriage as I speculated.

`

Vietvet:

Debbie told Bill before they left the Awards Banquet ON FRIDAY NIGHT she was getting a restraining order. I think that was a bit over the top but those 2 had been in a pissing contest for 2 weeks and he had attacked Doug that night. While Doug had something to do with it, he didn't ask her to do it or even suggest it. A lot of shit gets said and done in the heat of an argument, never mind a separation and divorce.

`

Bill's self-fulfilling profecy came to fruition that Friday. Bill accused her of cheating so instead of coming home to Bill as she told Bill she wanted to do, she went to the hospital with Doug. Apparantly later that night she had sex with Doug -- her first time outside the marriage. I wonder what Bill's real motive was in provoking the fight. Was he trying to cause a physical affair that he could justify bailing on?

You were right about when Bill left, it was as soon as he printed out the E-mails.

The night Dougie (Lance) first screwed Debbie was the night she came home at 11:30, kissed Dougie in his car in the driveway and went immediately to the shower without even coming close to Bill so he couldn't smell the sex on her. She later admitted this fact to Bill at his gym and said it was the first time although we only have her word and she has been lying to Bill for months if not years.

After rereading the entire story in context, it is evident that weekend Debbie went to her parents house after Bill accused Debbie of cheating, (because she couldn't look Bill in the eye and keep lying without giving herself away), which she later admitted to Bill that was the first time she had fucked Dougie's eyes out.

The fight at the award banquet was caused when Dougie inserted himself between Bill and Debbie while she was begging not to be exposed as a cheating whore to her colleagues.

Dougie had absolutely no business coming between a man and his wife if they were not coming to blows. Dougie fucked up and got his ass kicked by an old fat bald out of shape lawyer.

Good job Bill.

GG would appear to be wrong about the alleged rape as Debbie said she should have told Bill about it even though their marriage was in tatters he would still have hunted them down and killed them indicating the alleged rape was after Debbie started fucking Dougie.

You were also right about the restraining order, but Debbie told Bill not to come "home tonight" (the night of the banquet) even though he wasn't living there at the time indicating she didn't want Bill to find Debbie fucking Dougie in Bills bed.

Debbie went behind Bills back again when she filed for divorce instead of separation as she said she was going to do, and why? Maybe Dougie wanted her to?

So in conclusion, you forced me to reread the story and put things in order but it doesn't change the outcome and the overall conclusions of the story.

I keep wondering whether size14 actually read the story. Or at least chapter 1.

"Bill's self-fulfilling profecy came to fruition that Friday. Bill accused her of cheating so instead of coming home to Bill as she told Bill she wanted to do, she went to the hospital with Doug. Apparantly later that night she had sex with Doug -- her first time outside the marriage. I wonder what Bill's real motive was in provoking the fight. Was he trying to cause a physical affair that he could justify bailing on?"

What does "cheating" constitute in size14's worldview? Put Tab A in Slot B? Just the physical act of putting a penis in a vagina?

TONS of stuff happened with Debbie and Doug BEFORE the award ceremony. Even if it were true that Debbie didn't have sex with Doug until AFTER the award ceremony, do the months of flirting cybersex emails and dates count for nothing? There's completely nothing going on between Debbie and Doug? It is not cheating until Doug's cock was in Debbie's pussy?

Remember Doug bringing Debbie home with his car? And they made out in the car? That does not count as cheating? Maybe you're using the Clinton definition of sex? Debbie WAS cheating. Bill didn't just accuse her, he was actually RIGHT.

Bill's real motive was "I want to hurt you for seducing my wife". That doesn't really need any deep thoughts to explain. Doug stepped inbetween Debbie and Bill while they were having an argument. Doug pulled attention to himself. As you're so fond of saying, Doug created that scene by putting himself between Debbie and Bill.

You keep trying to put the blame on Bill while ignoring Debbie's actions, with every rebuttal you ignore that and cling onto something else. Even now with this chapter, you cling onto Debbie's rape as an excuse for everything she has done. The only thing the rape excuses her for is her vicious verbal attacks on Bill, not her cheating or her flirting with other men.

A shitty childhood and a rape does not make one a bad person by itself, you know? That's like saying serial killers with bad childhoods had no choice but to become serial killers. It's an explanation, not an excuse. People do have free will, how they exercise that will is up to them.

I get the distinct feeling that I have been talking, trying to explain to a brick wall all this time.

The 3 men that raped and tortured the women in Debbie's latest dream most likely did so in the past 5 or so years. I say this based upon the fact that one of the men called her "an old cunt." Now this conclusion only applies if Debbie's dream reflects reality AND the woman in her dream is actually Debbie herself.

Bill accused Debbie of fucking other men in chapter one and proceeded to operate as if that were true. His talking about and acting as if Debbie was fucking Doug instead of her having inappropriate conversations with him, caused the separation to be adversarial and messy. Obviously if Debbie's relationship with the professor she was mentoring had not shifted to one of a personal nature, this story, WWWM, would be dull and boring. However dull and boring it would have been, Debbie was divorcing Bill sooner of later. Without the Awards Banquet scene, it would have been later but it was coming. Bill's blaming the separation and divorce on Doug is Bill's way of making Debbie wrong and obscuring his failure to take responsibility for his part in the failure of the marriage. He's got everybody reading the story thinking the divorce is because Debbie cheated. Bill would like to think and have us think that the cheating was physical but that is just not so until after she told him not to come home and she was getting a restraining order to keep him away from her.

*

Is all this hate for Debbie being posted daily here our way of obscuring our own failures to sustain our marriages and placing the blame on the wife?

We would make a fine couple, all dressed up with no place to go. I hate it when that happens. <P>

I’ve enjoyed your comments. I agree with a lot of the things you’ve written. <P>

The author is stringing out the drama created by the inability of the main characters to communicate. As my grandfather was fond of saying “Time to shit or get off the pot.” He stated that all the characters have been introduced that are to play a part in this saga. Unfortunately that doesn’t mean he is close to wrapping it up. As you have noted he is a fine author but tends to go overboard with the filler. <P>

Debbie’s slutty character is starting to wear thin. Maybe psychotherapy will put her on the right track. Heaven only knows how many chapters and sub-plots it will require. I’ve about had it with Bill and his woe is me routine. Time for him to man up. It seems all the hot women in Florida are going to have to hit on him before he finally gets it. Don’t you just want to slap him upside the head? <P>

You should feel honored; I’m uncloaking to respond to you. Just teasing, I didn’t have the nerve to flaunting post a third signed anon comment on this chapter. <P>

PK

So, to you, basically it boils down to this: Everything that has happened after Chapter 1, all the problems, all the events, all the drama is due to one thing, that Bill thinks Debbie physically cheated on him when it wasn't true. It would've been completely smooth sailing if Bill thought Debbie had only started having sex with Doug after Chapter 1.

So Debbie rubbing in Bill's face about Doug's sexual prowess is Bill's fault. She wouldn't have done that if Bill had only thought she wasn't cheating! Suuuure.

Debbie demanding an utterly unreasonable amount of alimony is Bill's fault. This immediately makes me think you'll argue that the alimony was completely warranted, and that Bill is a complete asshole for not giving in. You'll say it was blackmail with the emails. Giving Debbie his money after her betrayal is just and right, ofcourse. I wish I was born a girl, so I could marry a guy, utterly screw him over and when he wants divorce, I'll make him pay me for the rest of his life. Awesome.

Adversarial and messy? Ofcourse it is, the nature of HOW the divorce came to be, WHY they want to divorce is messy. Debbie cheated. Period. If you actually want to argue THAT, there's nothing more to talk about. Debbie herself admits it was cheating when Lew showed her the emails. Not physical cheating, but emotional. Read that chapter.

Bill denying responsibility for his part in breaking up the marriage? What the? There have been several instances where Bill thought HE was at fault, with that shrink for example, and commenters have said Bill should stop being so wimpy and keep blaming himself. You're so fond of talking about Bill's self-fulfilling prophecy. That so-called self-fulfilling prophecy is practically the opposite of Bill denying responsibility.

Debbie cheated, hurt Bill in one of the worst ways a wife can hurt a husband, continues to do so (by having Doug move in), and THEN demands Bill give her his money for 20 years. She is very adversarial indeed. If ony she'd split 50-50, Irreconcilable Differences, and it would've been far less messy.

size14, YOUR smokescreen of continually pointing the finger of blame at Bill, while ignoring Debbie's much larger part of breaking up the marriage, just doesn't work.

Yes, Bill IS partially responsible, but ONLY blaming him, and ignoring Debbie's responsibility? That's like blaming the open tap for wrecking your home when a tsunami washes over it. The tapwater did contribute, but how much?

Well, I guess it's true what they say. Don't argue with an idiot, they'll bring you down to their level and beat you with experience. I feel like you've done just that to me. Or you're a troll who gets off on creating drama, and you keep baiting me. And silly me, I keep falling for it.

Anyway, this is pointless. I'm wasting time and energy on someone who is unwilling to actually understand, and keeps repeating the same wrong things over and over. I'm better off just reading the story itself, and not the comments.

I've said that before ofcourse, but yeah, WWWM is so good I just have to comment. I'll just have to stop myself responding to trollbait. Laters.

Whoops, one last thing. I forgot about this last part.

"Is all this hate for Debbie being posted daily here our way of obscuring our own failures to sustain our marriages and placing the blame on the wife?"

This is funny. All this so-called hate is because the character Debbie has done a lot of evil and hurtful stuff in the story. She is simply an unlikeable character as a human person. Moreso when people like you defend her and excuse her actions, or ignore them altogether.

Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar. There are no Freudian excuses. You on the other hand...size14, are you secretly a woman who has cheated on her husband, and are trying to justify it by defending Debbie? Is this your way of obscuring your guilt at hurting your husband?

Funny stuff, I say.